[https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Occam's\_razor](https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Occam's_razor)
>**Occam's razor**, Ockham's razor, or Ocham's razor (Latin: novacula Occami) in philosophy is the problem-solving principle that recommends searching for explanations constructed with the smallest possible set of elements. It is also known as **the principle of parsimony** or **the law of parsimony** (Latin: lex parsimoniae). Attributed to William of Ockham, a 14th-century English philosopher and theologian, it is frequently cited as Entia non sunt multiplicanda praeter necessitatem, which translates as "Entities must not be multiplied beyond necessity",\[1\]\[2\] although he never used these exact words. Popularly, the principle is sometimes paraphrased incorrectly as "The simplest explanation is usually the best one."\[3\]
it is a good word. This is a central tenant of the scientific method.
We say that "the earth is the center of the solar system" is *wrong* not because mathematician's can't make the math work for the earth being the center but because such a model is far more complex than the "sun is the center of the solar system".
**[Occam's razor](https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Occam's_razor)**
>Occam's razor, Ockham's razor, or Ocham's razor (Latin: novacula Occami) in philosophy is the problem-solving principle that recommends searching for explanations constructed with the smallest possible set of elements. It is also known as the principle of parsimony or the law of parsimony (Latin: lex parsimoniae). Attributed to William of Ockham, a 14th-century English philosopher and theologian, it is frequently cited as Entia non sunt multiplicanda praeter necessitatem, which translates as "Entities must not be multiplied beyond necessity", although he never used these exact words.
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As a person who took quite a few math classes in college it doesn't seem that esoteric to me but to most people yeah.
Come to think of it, esoteric is also a word I do not hear very often in public either.
It seems is if he is usually talking about concepts that are independent from a strict statistical point of view, although they appear to be more related/correlated with one another. I guess I’d have to look at a specific example, but that is my recollection.
No, he's usually talking about a geometric analogy rather than a statistical one. Like how intelligence is orthogonal to morality, which is how Nick Bostrom used it.
Is.... orthogonal... perhaps being used as a... metaphor? Synonyms: Correlational, intersecting
Yeah. Anybody see the interview with David Krakauer? In the book of compiled interviews. Krakauer, in "Complexity and Stupidity. In it, describes "Math, Mathematical Models, and Metaphors." Apparantly... people are prone to mixing them up. The first thing that comes to mind for me when I hear " orthogonal" is that it's simply a metaphor meaning "correlational."
Edit: Oh ok. IT WOULD THE EXACT OPPOSITE OF Correlational (if one were to use it as a metaphor or analogy) ! Glad I looked it up 😱. I'll hear it in sentences and phrases in the correct context from now on. 🙆🙆
"What is Orthogonality in Statistics? Simply put, orthogonality means “uncorrelated.” An orthogonal model means that all independent variables in that model are uncorrelated. If one or more independent variables are correlated, then that model is non-orthogonal."
https://www.google.com/url?sa=t&source=web&rct=j&url=https://www.statisticshowto.com/orthogonality/&ved=2ahUKEwik0M2kzNn8AhV1k2oFHdNFDgcQFnoECAYQBQ&usg=AOvVaw210kQek1ae4FKX4XWQYML4
The usage of " orthogonal" in geometry - "relating to right angles". Perpendicularity.
> The first thing that comes to mind for me when I hear " orthogonal" is that it's simply a metaphor meaning "correlational."
if *two variables are correlated* then they are **not orthogonal**. The original meaning comes from mathematics of vectors. Two vectors are orthogonal if their inner product equals 0. This definition extends the 2 (or 3) dimensional intuitions about orthogonal (right) angles into an arbitrary number of dimensions. Other sciences have coopted the word to mean things that are independent.
Human language does this all the time. One discipline creates a word for a useful concept in the discipline (e.g. orthogonal in math) and then other disciplines borrow the word to describe a somewhat analogous concept in their discipline. In the case of *orthogonal* the word always means *independent.*
I liked the MAKING SENSE episode with Niel DeGrasse Tyson. Got me to purchase his newest book. He thinks the fundamental tragedy of schooling is that the math of statistics is not mandatory. People would better understand complicated datasets as it relates to the Sciences.
Sorry, tangent. Nothing to do with current conversation. 😅
>People would better understand complicated datasets as it relates to the Sciences.
Heck, when election pollsters give a 60% probability that candidate X beats candidate Y and then candidate Y wins innumerate fools deride the pollster thinking the probabilities are like a basketball score and 60% should always beat 40%.
I agree with NdGT that statistics training should be given more weight.
It....had been esoteric to me. 😅 Less so now.
Dunno if I should plumb the depths further. Feel a bit of the Dunning Kruger confidence in entering this discussion winding downm
.
For anybody with a STEM background orthogonal is a pedestrian word as it permeates most of mathematics, along with vectors and matrices. [Orthogonal](https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Orthogonality) is so pervasive that wikipedia shows many other sciences have repurposed the word from mathematics to analogous concepts in other fields.
I guess is for folks with non-STEM backgrounds it may sound like a esoteric word.
I guess I am thinking of “general” language used across topics. Qualia may be a very common word used when discussing consciousness, but you would be very surprised to hear it in a discussion of politics.
I don't care how many times I see it, qualia is such a fucking weird word to my eyes and ears. Doesn't help the fact that it is a genuinely weird/hard concept for people to understand.
"Mr. Friedman: I think that issue is entirely orthogonal to the issue here
because the Commonwealth is acknowledging—
Chief Justice Roberts: I’m sorry. Entirely what?
Mr. Friedman: Orthogonal. Right angle. Unrelated. Irrelevant.
Chief Justice Roberts: Oh.
Justice Scalia: What was that adjective? I liked that.
Mr. Friedman: Orthogonal.
Chief Justice Roberts: Orthogonal.
Mr. Friedman: Right, right.
Justice Scalia: Orthogonal, ooh. (Laughter.)
Justice Kennedy: I knew this case presented us a problem. (Laughter.)"
Sam loves the culture wars and this is a great word for the topic. As usual, wikipedia is your friend. I love this word's origin.
I had heard *shibboleth* before Sam Harris used it but never knew its meaning until he used it enough that I looked it up.
Sam Harris, like George Carlin has a love of words that I share.
Ok, I haven't posted in a long time, but on account of the synchronicity.... FOR REAL THOUGH? I love his vocabulary, but some words just stick out. I literally googled the word orthogonal yesterday to get a clear definition to make sure I'm using it properly.
As a general rule I find that if a simpler more common word exists it's generally better to use it vs an advanced word that less people are likely to know.
The main intent of communicating ideas, particularly in the case of distributing knowledge, is to be understood by the widest audience possible. We want to maximize the probability of the idea being understood, reduce probability of misunderstanding. So the simpler the language, the wider the audience that can be reached.
The main barrier to entry on knowledge adquisición is vocabulary. For example you can see which kids fall behind in school purely by which kids have the least developed vocabulary at each grade once reading is required to further learn a subject in particular.
There are cases where precision requires the use of less common vernacular, but I would argue orthogonal should not be used outside of a math setting.
I agree with this but Sam's usage usually actually sharpens the meaning of what he's saying, unlike people who throw in fancy words just to sound fancy
>There are cases where precision requires the use of less common vernacular, but I would argue orthogonal should not be used outside of a math setting.
Sure, you could just say *independent* but that word also has lots of other connotations.
Sam sees himself as an intellectual trying to have honest intellectual discussions. In this context, his **fancy** words are not that fancy to other intellectuals and probably are most efficient for communicating his ideas.
If he was interested in building political power with anti-intellectuals he should definitely ***eschew*** words like orthogonal.
>[‘It’s a beautiful thing, the destruction of words](https://www.maier-files.com/its-a-beautiful-thing-the-destruction-of-words/). Of course the great wastage is in the verbs and adjectives, but there are hundreds of nouns that can be got rid of as well. It isn’t only the synonyms; there are also the antonyms. After all, what justification is there for a word which is simply the opposite of some other word?
***orthogonal*** is double plus unnecessary
Wheelhouse
Spurious
Phantasmagoria
Valence
Great word I learned in chemistry and try it’s artistic use elsewhere. Rarely however.
I've noticed myself saying that recently 😂
Valance
Salient
this is the one
Insidious.
Invidious
Darth Sidious
Harrisment
😂😂😂
Equanimity
There's a there there
but what's the cash value?
Came to say this. Wtf does it mean??
*It's not total bullshit. There's something worth examining.*
Defenestrate
Greatest word in the language, that.
Don't defenestrate me for not knowing that one.
I was defenestrated for trying to use this word in an actual conversation.
I'm sorry to hear that. Misusing a word really isn't a good reason to have your balls removed.
…hmm…
Ohhkayyy
He's got such a soothing and thoughtful "hmm"
Albeit
Nice
Quotidian
phenomenological
Sanguine
Confabulation
I prefer constrained confabulator
mouth noises
sanctimonious
I’d like to fuck Nicki Minaj
I am laughing so hard right now
Gotta love Reddit sometimes
Get her!
Stop upvoting this comment. It's only funny if you've scrolled through a dozen vocabulary words -- if it hits "top comment", it will be ruined.
THIS is the funny part.
By dint of
This thread is gold.
Verisimilitude
Simulacrum
Obscurantism
internecine
untenable
Insofar
Diaphanous
Beatific
Interlocutor
reductio ad absurdum
Ad nauseum
Confection
Intuitions
There’s no there there.
Bloviate
epistemological
I'm going to have to plant a flag there.
Housekeeping
Invidious
Odious
Parsimonious
[https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Occam's\_razor](https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Occam's_razor) >**Occam's razor**, Ockham's razor, or Ocham's razor (Latin: novacula Occami) in philosophy is the problem-solving principle that recommends searching for explanations constructed with the smallest possible set of elements. It is also known as **the principle of parsimony** or **the law of parsimony** (Latin: lex parsimoniae). Attributed to William of Ockham, a 14th-century English philosopher and theologian, it is frequently cited as Entia non sunt multiplicanda praeter necessitatem, which translates as "Entities must not be multiplied beyond necessity",\[1\]\[2\] although he never used these exact words. Popularly, the principle is sometimes paraphrased incorrectly as "The simplest explanation is usually the best one."\[3\] it is a good word. This is a central tenant of the scientific method. We say that "the earth is the center of the solar system" is *wrong* not because mathematician's can't make the math work for the earth being the center but because such a model is far more complex than the "sun is the center of the solar system".
**[Occam's razor](https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Occam's_razor)** >Occam's razor, Ockham's razor, or Ocham's razor (Latin: novacula Occami) in philosophy is the problem-solving principle that recommends searching for explanations constructed with the smallest possible set of elements. It is also known as the principle of parsimony or the law of parsimony (Latin: lex parsimoniae). Attributed to William of Ockham, a 14th-century English philosopher and theologian, it is frequently cited as Entia non sunt multiplicanda praeter necessitatem, which translates as "Entities must not be multiplied beyond necessity", although he never used these exact words. ^([ )[^(F.A.Q)](https://www.reddit.com/r/WikiSummarizer/wiki/index#wiki_f.a.q)^( | )[^(Opt Out)](https://reddit.com/message/compose?to=WikiSummarizerBot&message=OptOut&subject=OptOut)^( | )[^(Opt Out Of Subreddit)](https://np.reddit.com/r/samharris/about/banned)^( | )[^(GitHub)](https://github.com/Sujal-7/WikiSummarizerBot)^( ] Downvote to remove | v1.5)
Cash value
Pornographer
Coordination problem.
Orthogonal is the most esoteric word that he uses most frequently, from my informal study.
As a person who took quite a few math classes in college it doesn't seem that esoteric to me but to most people yeah. Come to think of it, esoteric is also a word I do not hear very often in public either.
Same. With a math background it really doesn't seem esoteric at all and makes perfect sense.
Good point. I was not a math major. I had to look up this definition. However, when Sam uses the word he is not talking about math, specifically.
No it's still the same relationship. He uses orthogonal in the same way a mathematician would: a dimension at right angles to some other dimension.
It seems is if he is usually talking about concepts that are independent from a strict statistical point of view, although they appear to be more related/correlated with one another. I guess I’d have to look at a specific example, but that is my recollection.
No, he's usually talking about a geometric analogy rather than a statistical one. Like how intelligence is orthogonal to morality, which is how Nick Bostrom used it.
Is.... orthogonal... perhaps being used as a... metaphor? Synonyms: Correlational, intersecting Yeah. Anybody see the interview with David Krakauer? In the book of compiled interviews. Krakauer, in "Complexity and Stupidity. In it, describes "Math, Mathematical Models, and Metaphors." Apparantly... people are prone to mixing them up. The first thing that comes to mind for me when I hear " orthogonal" is that it's simply a metaphor meaning "correlational." Edit: Oh ok. IT WOULD THE EXACT OPPOSITE OF Correlational (if one were to use it as a metaphor or analogy) ! Glad I looked it up 😱. I'll hear it in sentences and phrases in the correct context from now on. 🙆🙆 "What is Orthogonality in Statistics? Simply put, orthogonality means “uncorrelated.” An orthogonal model means that all independent variables in that model are uncorrelated. If one or more independent variables are correlated, then that model is non-orthogonal." https://www.google.com/url?sa=t&source=web&rct=j&url=https://www.statisticshowto.com/orthogonality/&ved=2ahUKEwik0M2kzNn8AhV1k2oFHdNFDgcQFnoECAYQBQ&usg=AOvVaw210kQek1ae4FKX4XWQYML4 The usage of " orthogonal" in geometry - "relating to right angles". Perpendicularity.
> The first thing that comes to mind for me when I hear " orthogonal" is that it's simply a metaphor meaning "correlational." if *two variables are correlated* then they are **not orthogonal**. The original meaning comes from mathematics of vectors. Two vectors are orthogonal if their inner product equals 0. This definition extends the 2 (or 3) dimensional intuitions about orthogonal (right) angles into an arbitrary number of dimensions. Other sciences have coopted the word to mean things that are independent. Human language does this all the time. One discipline creates a word for a useful concept in the discipline (e.g. orthogonal in math) and then other disciplines borrow the word to describe a somewhat analogous concept in their discipline. In the case of *orthogonal* the word always means *independent.*
Thanks for your extrapolation. My Dunning Kruger confidence on mathematics has hit the ceiling, and I need more than a moment or two to digest. 😅
I liked the MAKING SENSE episode with Niel DeGrasse Tyson. Got me to purchase his newest book. He thinks the fundamental tragedy of schooling is that the math of statistics is not mandatory. People would better understand complicated datasets as it relates to the Sciences. Sorry, tangent. Nothing to do with current conversation. 😅
>People would better understand complicated datasets as it relates to the Sciences. Heck, when election pollsters give a 60% probability that candidate X beats candidate Y and then candidate Y wins innumerate fools deride the pollster thinking the probabilities are like a basketball score and 60% should always beat 40%. I agree with NdGT that statistics training should be given more weight.
As a fellow dude with a math background, yep.
It....had been esoteric to me. 😅 Less so now. Dunno if I should plumb the depths further. Feel a bit of the Dunning Kruger confidence in entering this discussion winding downm .
It's used frequently in the sciences where orthogonal methods are sought.
For anybody with a STEM background orthogonal is a pedestrian word as it permeates most of mathematics, along with vectors and matrices. [Orthogonal](https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Orthogonality) is so pervasive that wikipedia shows many other sciences have repurposed the word from mathematics to analogous concepts in other fields. I guess is for folks with non-STEM backgrounds it may sound like a esoteric word.
What’s more esoteric and arcane to the general pop then math? I doubt even 1% of HS grads could tell you what a2+b2=c2 is called.
Exoteric is even more obscure
I think for a year after I first heard it in linear algebra for deep learning, I still had no idea what it actually meant.
Qualia is up there too!
I guess I am thinking of “general” language used across topics. Qualia may be a very common word used when discussing consciousness, but you would be very surprised to hear it in a discussion of politics.
I don't care how many times I see it, qualia is such a fucking weird word to my eyes and ears. Doesn't help the fact that it is a genuinely weird/hard concept for people to understand.
I wonder if he knows it’s use in linear algebra. Orthogonal is used to describe vectors which sit on different planes, opposite planes.
"Mr. Friedman: I think that issue is entirely orthogonal to the issue here because the Commonwealth is acknowledging— Chief Justice Roberts: I’m sorry. Entirely what? Mr. Friedman: Orthogonal. Right angle. Unrelated. Irrelevant. Chief Justice Roberts: Oh. Justice Scalia: What was that adjective? I liked that. Mr. Friedman: Orthogonal. Chief Justice Roberts: Orthogonal. Mr. Friedman: Right, right. Justice Scalia: Orthogonal, ooh. (Laughter.) Justice Kennedy: I knew this case presented us a problem. (Laughter.)"
Sam tries to inject quite a few maths terms into everyday speech; how about summing the area under the curve on that issue
Ramify Reify
On the menu of experiences
Quixotic
unpack
Trump-is-tan
anodyne
Auto-da-fé
Radicchio
Potted bio
Sisyphean is my favorite that I actually use but some of these are orthogonal to my everyday vocabulary
Lapidary
lapidarian and aphoristic
Shibboleth
Sam loves the culture wars and this is a great word for the topic. As usual, wikipedia is your friend. I love this word's origin. I had heard *shibboleth* before Sam Harris used it but never knew its meaning until he used it enough that I looked it up. Sam Harris, like George Carlin has a love of words that I share.
Ok, I haven't posted in a long time, but on account of the synchronicity.... FOR REAL THOUGH? I love his vocabulary, but some words just stick out. I literally googled the word orthogonal yesterday to get a clear definition to make sure I'm using it properly.
Jettison
Normative
Okaaaaaay….
I read it in Sam’s voice. How’d you do that?
“I had yet to do mushrooms blindfolded”. Sam on Huberman podcast.
Perspicacious
Species of an idea
Pontification Ps, dis my fav word to use
I mean, he is first and foremost a writer
Fugue state
Cogitations
Cantankerous
I wasn’t raped by a jaguar, but I can’t say we’re entirely on platonic terms either.
ERGO! VIS-À-VIS! CONCORDANTLY
Vicissitudes
Exculpatory
Most English words I know I know just from Sam using them in context
Paradoxical
Asymptote.
Odious
Germane
Deleterious
cacophony
Human flourishing.
deontological
doesn't hold water
baby in the bathwater
bouffant
Obtoose
Hi
[удалено]
Keeping?
Someone do some housekeeping and throw this guy out of the sub jk
segue
Didnt have idea what this meant until sam said it a bunch. Still dont have a great idea... lol. Guess ill google it quick.
Religiosity
frigorrific
As a general rule I find that if a simpler more common word exists it's generally better to use it vs an advanced word that less people are likely to know. The main intent of communicating ideas, particularly in the case of distributing knowledge, is to be understood by the widest audience possible. We want to maximize the probability of the idea being understood, reduce probability of misunderstanding. So the simpler the language, the wider the audience that can be reached. The main barrier to entry on knowledge adquisición is vocabulary. For example you can see which kids fall behind in school purely by which kids have the least developed vocabulary at each grade once reading is required to further learn a subject in particular. There are cases where precision requires the use of less common vernacular, but I would argue orthogonal should not be used outside of a math setting.
I agree with this but Sam's usage usually actually sharpens the meaning of what he's saying, unlike people who throw in fancy words just to sound fancy
I generally agree, however I think Sam is guilty of unconsciously doing that due to his prior tenure on academia.
>There are cases where precision requires the use of less common vernacular, but I would argue orthogonal should not be used outside of a math setting. Sure, you could just say *independent* but that word also has lots of other connotations. Sam sees himself as an intellectual trying to have honest intellectual discussions. In this context, his **fancy** words are not that fancy to other intellectuals and probably are most efficient for communicating his ideas. If he was interested in building political power with anti-intellectuals he should definitely ***eschew*** words like orthogonal.
However Sam has explicitly stated his goal is to spread ideas to the widest audience, as his form of effective altruism.
>[‘It’s a beautiful thing, the destruction of words](https://www.maier-files.com/its-a-beautiful-thing-the-destruction-of-words/). Of course the great wastage is in the verbs and adjectives, but there are hundreds of nouns that can be got rid of as well. It isn’t only the synonyms; there are also the antonyms. After all, what justification is there for a word which is simply the opposite of some other word? ***orthogonal*** is double plus unnecessary
Bloviating
Ostentatious
When Sam uses this word, what does he usually mean by it? The definition is “relating to right angles,” and “statistically independent”
Alacrity
NFT
Bracket
esoterica
Quantum mind
Hidetheball
vicissitudes
Scrumtrulescent
I wonder which one of y'all word be in charge of the Sam Harris fan club website back in the day.
Jape
Heuristic
Euclidean dimensions are such
Evergreen
Okay....
Zero-sum
Rounding error
Anachronistic
Average day on r/samharris
grok
Eudaemonia
Best of 2023
The cash value on that topspin
Salient.
Verbal Plumage
ELEPHANT IN THE BRAIN 😅. Dunno if anybody listened to that particular episode. Writer Hanson.
Look it the big brains on Sam. Lol Yeah I get a kick out of some of the crazy words Sam uses
Reputational potlatch
Is vs ought
Aprosodia anyone?
There's a drinking game in here
Interlocutor
Specious.