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An_Unreachable_Dusk

I'm surprised they haven't incited more American "prepper" culture in the cult considering they always talk about having to leave and hide in the bush or in bunkers xD where are these bunkers? what food and water they going to use?, most of the jw's i knew didn't even have a to go bag for a real emergency they just "trusted jehobo" they are in the ultimate idea of "someone else will sort it out/fix it" and its a terrible mindset. no wonder when people leave its so hard, suddenly You are responsible for yourself and the world you live in, that's got to be hard >\_< Although now that i think about it if they pushed prepper culture they would have less money coming in, but these people are dense as fuck and can't think ahead half a step.


[deleted]

I talked to my mom about how I was gathering some camping equipment in a project (which I call "potential future homelessness"), and she immediately suggested I buy a ton of powdered bullshit from [4Patriots.com](https://4Patriots.com) (which is marked up to all hell). Trust me, they're out there, and they're getting grifted by the same people who are grifting QAnon conservatives.


ringoftruth

Re: your flair (great flair, by the way). I was actually shocked to learn if you take witnesses beliefs to their natural philosophical conclusion in "theory of mind", they7 believe in what's known as "strong A.I." (Artificial intelligence)😳


[deleted]

I wouldn't even disagree with that, and I'd argue that strong A.I. is just as much sentient as ourselves. We are restrained by our biological conditioning, but an A.I. will only be restrained by our highest sense of human reason that we've trained into it.


An_Unreachable_Dusk

Damn >\_<


metaltankmx

Have you been around them recently? Because a lot of members in my family's congregations have been gathering emergency bags and supplies. Hell, my mom has been binging on prepper videos on Youtube. They're apparently ready to grab their stuff and leave their houses the moment the borg says so.


ringoftruth

I was going to say the whole grab bag, prepper thing was unheard of when I was a JW in Britain, but I think that contagion has even reached here which is utterly ridiculous. I mean in the US there are geographical areas where there is *some* rationale behind the whole prepper thing - for example a grab bag/emergency supplies if you live in an area where forest fires are prevalent, for instance. But why would you do that in the UK? You might get the odd burst water main, I suppose :/


An_Unreachable_Dusk

Yeah i'm in Australia and left jw's like 12 years ago and it was different then, i think most people i know now have a prepped bag incase of fire or flood and i don't hang around jw's lol :P i just remember them trusting in god when i was younger lol


Vegetable_Concert_24

To be a "prepper" you often need to own your property... And in much of the world window cleaners can't afford to buy a house.


JudyLyonz

JW are about as prepper as you can get without being full on anti-government gun nuts.


An_Unreachable_Dusk

I'm in Australia and left the cult 12 years ago, they were not like that back then xD


pizzasushidog

I’m in NZ and they’ve been a bit prepper-y for the last maybe 5 yrs. Some friends of mine even did a “go-bag weekend” a couple times.


Tmp_Guest_1

as european i can confirm this totally. a little example: God Bless you. very frowned up for JWs to say this after someone sneezes. here we say "Gesundheit" which translates to "wish you health" or such thing. can you imagine how the WT magazine managed to make it as unclear as possible whats bad about wishing something to someone sneezing, regardless what they say? i could understand if they take out God Bless you, but here in germany it is mostly frowned upon to even say Gesundheit. What radical asshole bullshit is this? its because the almighty 8 Babboons and friends have american googles, and think that the whole world is like their Warwick bubble. there arent any other cultures, meanings, languages etc. another example: College or any higher education in any form. The way movies and Popculture show the american campus live is like: Sex Drugs and Rock N Roll. can be true or not i dont care, but over here were i live, we dont live in dorms when going to uni, you dont have to have some activities outside your courses etc. the whole anti education bullshit is just thanks to the whole "american way". please note, that i dont mean american way or america in a bad way per se. i just want to show that there are very clear differences which simply dont apply to the whole world. next example: COVID yes they wanted to reopen the Kingdomhalls if possible, despite all the restrictions right now. instead of waiting more time, they just jump out because of some Branchletters about having pilot congregations to meet in person again. and why was this so? because in america the situation was different. i cant blame america on this, but the whole lore about how PIMIS behave is about what they fart out in warwick. because the sheep need to follow every instruction like its Gods word. the Rank and File dont think enough. elders and above are simply obey obey obey, to a point where they dont even question often if they should apply some stuff or not in their localities. the same with beards, what to wear (buisness monkey style), etc etc etc. they have 8 cult leaders, but all of them are living in America. no wonder they have only america googles on their head. they live in a bubble and think the world revolves around them. often JWs i knew had a hard time to understand whats the problem with xy, because it was more an american one than the rest of the world. and than some extra superduper uber elders and COs and talkers want to make their uber spiritual talks and twist the stuff to a way it fits in the narrative, even if it dont work, just to make the borg seem to be right about every tissue issue.


arrogancygames

Education currently is based around education being the "cure" to their brainwashing. They see the numbers of college educated born ins not becoming a JW and just see it as bad, worldwide.


sequinspearlsjujubes

Yes. Higher education is discouraged because it teaches students how to think critically and question belief systems instead of meekly accepting what someone says. That is true in any culture.


metaltankmx

The way they rationalized in Spanish not saying "salud" (meaning health, which I guess makes it similar in sentiment to Gesundheit) after sneezing, was that it is a form of superstition and not just common courtesy. Also, that it is the same word people use when toasting. Also, the college thing makes less sense over here. Because of the way education works here, college is less about learning to think for yourself, question your beliefs, broadening your horizons and similar stuff that would corrupt a good christian, and more about just learning a career.


arrogancygames

That's how college is in most places. Issue is that you still start learning logic and philosophy in a lot of careers. For instance, in marketing, you take psychology classes. In programming, you focus hugely on logic. Even in art and writing, you intend get philosophy peppered in. Fundamentalist Christians and Conservatives HATE college in America because their BS tactics stop working once someone gets anything beyond high school level logic or philosophy and psychology.


WyrdenCN

You sure have a lengthy reply! Thanks for the effort. And yeah you seem to hit the nail on the head there! I think many of you see what I meant, just wanted to raise some awareness to it!


587BCE

Our country had no covid for a year and everyone was back to normal. All the other churches were meeting in person but jws still on zoom. Same too about higher education here. No dorms. You still live at home while studying. There is nothing wild about it. Kind of just a sensible thing to do really getting qualified to do a job that enables you to support yourself.


MercuryDime2370

What country are you from?


587BCE

Nz


Fluffy_Tone_2274

It is an American Conservative Christian religion. That's how they operate. Definitely. You'll find similarities in all of those Millerite movements, Adventists, Baptists, use the same playbook. The Organisation love saying they're not an American religion because of their International brotherhood, but it's still governed by an American way of thinking. For years their publications, dramas, videos had little to no relevance to the rest of the world, especially those living in third world countries, even now, there are many who still don't identify with the material they put out there.


WyrdenCN

Yeah that was exactly my point! It's a playbook used by so many other American religions and organisations or companies. If you've ever seen how MLM companies operate and hold their conventions, the similarities are striking and in my opinion influenced by American culture.


Fluffy_Tone_2274

Absolutely a MLM operation. Makes sense, since Russell was obsessed with Pyramids.


DaFade

Well it's in the Bible: Jesus would rise up and wait for America to be discovered. Then look for a sincere group of Americans, who own a printing company to carry out his father's will. Jesus then explained to Russell that the pyramids held the secret to when the end would come. But first we need to find a Mansion in San Diego for some friends I'm expecting shortly. All legit!


Fluffy_Tone_2274

🤣🤣


Professional_Two_639

Lol


UtahStateAgnostics

I'm gonna toss Mormons in on that list (I'm exmo). I lived in Japan for a while and only heard messages concerning the US (and specifically Utah) from the higher ups in official publications. And always with the perceived persecution.


MercuryDime2370

So true. Thanks for mentioning 3rd world countries. My husband from Latin America always felt hurt by the photos of people in beautiful houses doing their personal/family study and deciding to work part-time and pioneer. The photos always made him feel left out and like this was an American/Westernized/1st world religion.


Equivalent_Edge_6281

It's not a religion. Jehovah's Witness Is a cult.


DaFade

Let up it one. All religions are basically a cult!


Equivalent_Edge_6281

All human beings need something or someone to have faith in otherwise mankind would perish in their loneliness


Player00000000

As a kid coming from UK in the 80's it only struck me how American the religion was when I heard the drama at an assembly or on the audiotapes of the Bible being read, because at that time everything was paper based. The pronunciation of Jehoohvah Gud as against Jehowva God was jarring to my ear. I suppose everyone has gotten used to that now everything has become audio visual. It's seems like they only consider something truly important or relevant if it happens close to home. They don't comment on or cater much to culture outside of the USA. I thought about that when I read Leaving the Witness by Amber Scorah. Its probably easier to swallow that for example, a Bible prophecy could have been fulfilled by an American assembly 60 years ago if you were an American, than if you had to explain that to a Chinese person. From the UK, the religion seems quite alien and cut off from prevailing attitudes here, but i think it fits more contextually within America where there is much more of an Evangelical religious hard core presence.


BranSul

Speaking as an American, this is all true, but it is more like a parody of American culture than an actual reflection of it. Right-wing American Christians do believe they are persecuted when they definitely aren't, but JW's are next level on this aspect. That sense of persecution doesn't really reflect America outside of right-wing American Christians though. There was an episcopal priest in America who made a tiktok telling Christians to stop whining because they aren't persecuted in America ... and of course they felt persecuted by that tiktok. Lol.


arrogancygames

It's a specific subset of America; more like American Christian, which makes sense as a lot of people came here from Europe as Protestants and practiced a hyper fundamental form of it. Europe evolved to be a bit more secular over time while America is still majorly influenced and partially controlled by its Christian roots. Also why the country is more right-wing/Conservative than most other Western nations. We have growing progressivism here, but our balance of religious to non religious explains most of us. Russell, and by extension, the rest of the religion was born from a subset of a subset of American Christian religion, and thus carries those tendencies.


Abalabi_jw

Excellent perspective. All but few gb members have been Americans. The charlatans Russell and his lieutenant Rutherford are from the USA


Dee_silverlake

This religion came out of the Pennsylvania doomsday religious movements, doesn't get any more American than that!


freelivingaussie

This ^


tragomaskhalos

Exhibit A for this is the Mormons - people so annoyed that the bible has the *affrontery* to completely ignore the US that they invented an entire spin-off set of books pretending that loads of extra biblical shit happened there


Original-Letter6994

I feel like the US itself has a bit of a cult mentality, which seems to be a breeding ground for further cults and MLMs. I grew up in America and I was also born into the borg. They’re both so insular and propagandized, and seem designed to keep their members complacent. You grow up here and believe you’re special, because you were born into the greatest organization in the world. You’re constantly fed the idea that you have freedom, while they hold the consequences of any failure to comply over your head and alienate you from everyone on the outside so you believe you have nowhere else to go. There are people in high positions who put on a face but seem to be exempt from the rules. I realize most of these qualities apply to other countries as well, but I think America may be an especially egregious example.


crapslap99

Persecution adds validity to their claim as God‘s chosen people because Jesus said that his people will be persecuted now put down that Taco Bell and pick up your torture stake. I believe the governing body gets a Boner when they find out JW is being persecuted somewhere so they make a Point to bring it up as often as possible to show look we are Jehovah’s chosen people


Major-Fondant-8714

Yes, be toxic, offensive, and insulting to others and when they respond in kind... persecution. This seems to be the game of all fundamentalist type religions... the famous self-fulfilling 'prophecy'.


tragomaskhalos

Historically I guess the first European settlers in America were people who thought Puritanism - the template for all fun-hating uber-xtian denominations - wasn't extreme enough! It's a cultural strand that extends unbroken to the modern day; consider for example that it would be political suicide for a US Presidential candidate to admit to being an atheist.


Ensorcellede

There's an interesting essay on JWfacts that looks at how JWs have evolved to mirror the changes in American society over the decades. https://www.jwfacts.com/watchtower/the-truth-vs-the-truth.php


Mysterious_Morning95

I have had the benefit of living overseas and I come from an immigrant family so I totally understand where you are coming from. You are spot on. This culture of the witnesses is purely American in nature and unfortunately one of America's worst exports.


Desperate_Habit_5649

>From what I as a European person can gather, the culture of Americaseems to be an explanation for some of the policies and directionswithin the religion. Considering the WBT$ JW Cult was started in the USA. Is governed from the USA...And..Most of the WBT$ Popes are from the USA. There\`s a good chance there\`s a Strong USA influence, within the WBT$. Although, that\`s just a Wild Guess.😁


TheStumbler83

I always thought the dress codes, and the religions whole aesthetic, was very 1950s America


To_Live_Question

Well that’s what we can expect from a “religious movement” that emerged from mainline American Adventism.


crapslap99

Persecution in America is when you get out of work at 10 PM but Taco Bell closes at 9 PM 🤣


MultiStratz

But your guts will thank you in the morning!🤣


Blooming-Emotion

I lived half of my life in Europe and half in the US, and my perspective on your question is yes, up to a point. Here's where I'd add a little more nuance: I think Europeans often see 'American' culture as one easily defined concept, while it's not. The US is a huge country, and there is enormous regional, social, ethnic, and political variety. JWs share a lot with the conservative religious right in the US in some ways, and are very different in others. Here are two random examples that come to mind. I think they are similar in that they have an unhealthy, extreme focus on individual responsibility and behavior control. Also, more often than not, pleasure and enjoying life are big no-no's. Some visual/aesthetic details are also quite 'American' (e.g. how ugly kingdom halls usually are when compared to say Catholic or Nordic protestant churches, the obsession for 'formal' but rather unfashionable attire - at least in European terms, etc.) But on the other hand, they're very different in many other ways. For example (and this is a big one!), they don't embrace the crappy my-bible my-country my-guns philosophy (and thank goddess for that!).


arrogancygames

Yeah as someone who has spent a lot of time elsewhere in the world, there is a huge confusion about what America is because other countries don't really understand how our states work and how that correlates to rural vs. metropolitan areas. For instance, outside of Oklahoma City and Tulsa, *every single major city* in the United States voted blue in the last election. Our representation in the country does not match this because in some states, there is just more rural area than city to the point that the people that actually live next to other people get overriden by people living in small towns or in the middle of nowhere. Those states have a huge amount of representation in this country, ridiculously so with the Senate, so it makes the country look different from the outside. The only comparable places with size are Canada and Australia, and their rural areas aren't as filled in or represented as the US. And on top of that, our rural areas tend to lean strongly Christian unlike the cities, so, it is what it is.


Blooming-Emotion

I completely agree, it's like two different countries, and the politics are super complicated! I live in an urban, strongly blue-leaning area, and when I go visit friends in rural Trumpland, I get severe culture shock! And we're talking a 3-hour drive from where I live.


philz_tsuki2817

Probably not as shocking as Europe, where a 3 hour drive in any direction would take you to a different country with a different culture and set of languages and rules of the road! Haha


Blooming-Emotion

Ha, think again! I'll take European cultural/linguistic differences any day of the week over going from a 'normal' place, to one where there are more fundamentalist churches and gun stores than schools and grocery stores 😄


jesushadasixpack

They are promoting 1950’s Americana - the stuff you’d see in feel-good TV shows, like Leave it to Beaver, that never existed in reality. It was just the ideal. They mistakenly believe that that stuff is real, implying that those god-awful shows were documentaries. In reality, both of my grandparents who were married in the 50’s had awful marriages filled with domestic violence, substance abuse, and child abuse. The American culture the GB promotes never actually existed. People in that era wanted feel-good fluff to forget the horrors of WWII. The world has not gotten worse. People might just be more okay with viewing sad realities than they were in the past.


ForeignIndependent7

I ironically developed a disdain for the United States because of being raised as a Jehovah’s Witness 😂🤣🤣


WatchTowel

Absolutely. Puritan Spirit


587BCE

It was always funny watching the dramas acted out at the assemblies with people lip miming the american voices. The americanness really became more obvious with the introduction of videos. A friend of mine actually auditioned for a role in a video and one of the requirements was being able to do an American accent. Lol. So much for diversification.


shortfriday

JWs are an American religion through and through, but I would argue that you're generalizing about the worst of the United States and that JW religious culture has mutated severely and become distant from the mainstream of American culture. > there is a constant feeling of prosecution which also seems very ingrained in American culture Religious persecution has always existed, people from different faiths murdering each other because they worship differently, so victim/martyr complex is absolutely not unique to Christianity or JWs. There is a unique flavor of Christian persecution mentality in the US, but in my experience, it's largely a political propaganda device foisted on the underclasses that vote conservative, "vote for the more extreme Christian or they're going to turn your children Muslim," meanwhile it's all a ploy to help the corporatist faction. It's not even a very intelligent con, we had a Christian Dominionist president, followed by a nominal Christian, and then another nominal Christian with a dominionist VP, but people are tribal so they go along with it. JWs are supposed to be apolitical, a huge divergence from the mainstream, so I don't think they really participate in this trend. > taking very little account and value to the perspective and opinion of other people. Eh? It's a religion not a lunch menu. This might be my JW upbringing talking, but if your religion is tolerant of other faiths that explicitly deride your faith, it's not much of a religion, is it? Also, JWs are a cult, what do you expect? > Doomsday prepping JWs don't do this and I don't think they ever will. They are a religion of lower middle and working class people who couldn't afford to do doomsday prepping. I also suspect that the course that would be prescribed by the church would just be to lay down and die when the stormtroopers come for you, why waste your time and money prepping when you're going to be resurrected in a month. > The revering of persons high up an organization Compare US or British Catholics to literally any others the world over. > Televangelism The web content that has emerged in the last 5 or 10 years very vaguely hints in the direction of televangelism, but I don't think it will ever resemble the kind of evil money-grubbing that you can just find on regular tv.


WyrdenCN

The reason I generalised most of my statements Indeed is unfair to all Americans, yet I needed to do so to make my point. I'm not going to refute every single one of your points, yet think about this: JWs do think Armageddon will happen soon(TM). This to my mind is a kind of doomsday preparedness. Regardless of how much they invest in it with their money. JWs have turned to televangelism. The fact that they do it differently in comparison to other money grubbing schemes doesn't change the fact that it's televangelism. You sound like you're trying to undermine my points by trying to dismantle them individually on the wording that I used, instead of accepting the premise that as a European person who can only observe American culture from a very distant perspective there are definitely some things that I would deem very American. I didn't provide that much context to my examples, yet you should know that they are way more nuanced in my mind, however, a simple post on Reddit trying to create awareness is not the time nor place to go full into detail about every single thing. Nonetheless thank you for your reply.


FacetuneMySoul

Yeah I’ve had this discussions with PIMQ JWs from Europe. I told them how much is rooted in the puritanical cultural foundation of the US. And of course, JWs directly evolved from the American Millenialist religious movement of the late 19th century. You really get a sense of this when you get more acquainted with Asian cultures. Having been in a foreign language congregation that was an Asian language and largely non Christian culture, I was struck by how they decidedly viewed this as an American religion. And while there were surface attempts to appear to accommodate their cultures, to assure them we’re not attempting to “Americanize” them, I still reached a point where preaching to them felt very icky. All the ridiculous of it hit me.


PriorityMaleficent

It's almost like hidden colonialism. Removing the culture of people and replacing it with another.


BMXTKD

Ding ding ding. My family are immigrants. They know jack shit about American cultural nuances, despite being here for nearly half a century. Like they don't know that the JWs are using their family for free labor, and there's a history of white Europeans using people in the "Third World" for free labor.


PremierEditing

Ironically, I think a lot of the cultier aspects actually started as adaptations to survive persecution by Communist governments during the Cold War, which then completely metastasized into what they are today. Strict shunning of ex-witnesses, for instance, was largely adopted in those countries because recruiting ex-witnesses was one of the most effective ways for the Stasi and other groups to insert spies into their operations. Similarly, the way that terminology gets changed semi-regularly and books get changed around (and I'm talking things like song books, where there is no real doctrinal content) is a useful way to spot someone who has been gone for awhile and is now trying to get involved again.


kickflip20

Totally agree!!!! I’ve lived in a few European countries and spent a lot of time with Americans and so many times have I told them thats not really a rule we follow here 😂 I remember two particular times when one US guy was visiting and I told him half the pioneers in my hall where at university. The guy nearly fainted and said they’d be reproved if in US. Another was when a bearded elder went on the platform to do a talk. Again the American did not know what was happening 😅


loveofhumans

Often, often and more often. The wording at conventions, the dress codes. The wt needs to realize that it is not a case of OSFA being one size fits all.


loveofhumans

*"they have 8 cult leaders, but all of them are living in America. no* *wonder they have only America googles on their head. they live in a* *bubble and think the world revolves around them."* Among the very best descriptions I have ever seen.


Fadetoex

Aus an Australian I agree. Much of the rhetoric and news is so US centred. All sorts of things can be happening in the world but as soon as it starts impacting US JWs and especially US Bethel then it’s “Armageddon is here…”.


StarTemple

And, imo, it is actually deeper than many realize, but there are a few reasons it rooted here in America for the last "Reformation Blast". And, it is not going away, instead it double-backed and re-rolled back over the world religious system. If one studies the Reformation from 1517, there were centuries of a euro-struggle made worse "for general Christians seeking freedom" by having nasty Rome and the Roman Catholic Church in Europe's own backyard, right where these Christians and others, sought "freedom from Rome" in its spiritual leg of oppression. And by seeing the Reformation timeline, it was a far more intense "spiritual war" in Europe with all its Christian evolutionary steps as everything Catholic, in relation to the Christian ministry, was autopsied and questioned and patched, sometimes over and over again. All the Protestant developments of ministerial type, all sprung up in this huge history. But, as the Reformation progressed in waves, the trip to America was also maturing in progress and so the luxury of being far from Rome's Catholic Inquisition persecutions resulted in Adventism being able to be born in 1800s America. And when Adventism did break, one will find its new "wake up people, Christ is about to drop in" urgency and some other unique traits with it, also reflected this "new world" American psyche. This period also gave birth to the Charles Russell types of preacher traits. Then IBSA and JWs, etc. It is ALL related and connected---and that relationship will continue, imo. So the American DNA also continued to influence Adventism as most if not all of the later Christian movements in America were its children. (No one ever could "reform" a Christian religion. New sects breaking out was the ONLY WAY to try something "reformed" and new; hence, the number of Christian sects.) So, many ministries, such as rock-star televangelism, took on this unique "American mind" aspect which then BOOMERANGED back to Europe to drive a proverbial stake into the heart of its arch-villain enemy number 1, the "apostate" vampire Pope and the whole Catholic church. That saw the outlawing of the Inquisition and the relegation of the Papal system to a fraud Christian gloried political-clown troupe, which then had to run their circus without being able to apply violence to the Protestant counter-movement. So, Adventism and its American streak would end up influencing the last wave of the late Reformation where it all began. To get into the JW WT deeper continued aspect is now a study in true cult-control pathology. WT and JWs continued to ferment the "uniquely American" madness even beyond any doomsday movement around them in scale and organizational propagative technique. I ADMIT THIS IS HUMAN SPECULATION RIGHT OFF THE BAT; NEXT, IS A GUESS GIVEN THE (Reformation "reaction" principle and) TRAJECTORY WHICH SEEMS TO BE TRENDED THUS FAR IN ALL OF THIS. But, in like manner, IF WT shoots its own head off shutting up JWs for good or to a serious degree, that should spark, imo, *a final "Christian reaction"* in once again initial non-religious form, just like the Reformation roots. Even if JWs are no Catholicism in scale, them going down in total "fake doomsday" GLOBAL failure should spark up the Christian crowds the world over, as they celebrate the demise of the hideous WT global-troll. (JWs have taken on a Papal Catholic "mini-me" nemesis aspect now, especially to xjw "protesters". The "vengeance" will also be sent back on what is left of WT and JWs, in time.) That last generic Christian reaction round will have thousands of bad guesses and unbalanced "false prophet" brimstone soap box doctors of doomsday, of course, BUT mixed into it, it will also arise with a "Christian and prophecy" summary that does nail actual global issues--- like pertaining to world government---(a development JWs fully missed altogether "in prophecy" AND the real world, btw) Somewhere in that "final reaction", there should be, imo, the addressing of the post-fake-doomsday actual trek into the actual "doomsday free" future, out of global crisis to recovery and the future world peace mantra and drive. And imo, the rise of a globalization completion process into a truly globalized, tech backed, super-corporate "world government" is where the can will roll, and the United Nations will continue to be its global-nucleus and international forum in then actual global legislative activation. (No matter how the UN may be renamed and finally branded) In the process: 1. Zero "doomsday" will manifest, it was all a diversion myth; 2. JW false-prophecy and premature expectation will have utterly and soundly failed first. 3. The whole Christian overall "prophecy forecast" of rapture and utter cataclysm and "Christ arrival" will also have failed, into a UN centric "world peace" recovery instead. 4. Any global world crisis will run a doom-looking course at first, as usual, only to recover peacefully, (also as usual), and this time "heal" into a hugely hopeful world future; I ADMIT THIS TOO IS HUMAN SPECULATION along this line of late-globalism and UN future theories from geo-political forecasters, such as described at this link... [https://www.democracywithoutborders.org/12164/four-scenarios-on-the-future-of-the-united-nations/](https://www.democracywithoutborders.org/12164/four-scenarios-on-the-future-of-the-united-nations/) ...With a parallel of what Christianity was also trying to convey at various times of "awakening". That above "future of the UN theories" link, is about as simple as I have seen that general overview laid out. I ADMIT THIS TOO IS HUMAN SPECULATION with a view to taking some guess into a "doomsday free" global outlook phase, free of any religious doomsday diversioning. Those concepts in that link above are plainly known basic geo-political scenarios studied in the science of globalism in general, "in the world", as to the final evolution of planetary management challenges and the possibility of global governance existing past the expiration of the "nation-state era" "national government" phase. That "old world order" national-system history ALSO PARALLELS that whole post 1517 "global Reformation effect"---both the Euro to global nation-state phase going "past Rome", and the last Christian world "late-Adventism" evolutions, have paralleled and influenced each other this whole time, and they are integral, imo, to each others reality. This post-crisis final future phase is hopeful imo, and it will "self-summarize" what it has been "all about" the whole time in a manner complex or chimp simple. Then, anyone will be able to understand "what is going on", and it was NOT any distracting useless "doomsday"--- it turns out totally different (as usual) imo. lol


uglyfang

It's a puritanical offshoot


blueknightfox

It's American conservatism and the most extreme level. I think some if not most JW's know this but won't admit it.


FacetuneMySoul

Not really. JW beliefs don’t align with any political group much. They’re very anti weapons and guns, don’t support military or police, are very in favor of ethnic mixing, are typically in favor of welfare type programs, etc.


BMXTKD

You just described a blue dog Urban Democrat.


FacetuneMySoul

Wouldn’t they typically at least tolerate premarital sex and homosexuality and balk at ideas of “male headship”? That’s why JWs don’t fit with any political group.


BMXTKD

I don't think you know what a blue dog is.


FacetuneMySoul

I don’t, but JWs are pretty extreme on those issues compared to most non JWs. And I’m talking official stances that they’re willing to publish opinions on. But if they’re centrists who are fiscally liberal and socially conservative, sure that’s probably closest to average JW values.


BMXTKD

They are socially conservative Democrats.


bliip666

Needs some Kraft cheese