T O P
JimmyPWatts

Well, that pretty much encapsulates all whining about “wokeness”. Much ado about nothing, from the people who love to clamor about personal responsibility and pulling yourself up by your bootstraps. Yet just a few lines about concepts of equality are enough to make them have a meltdown. Pretty hysterical.


ToastedGhostJay

I read all the banter and i am against the anti-white line but that guy went about it all wrong. You cant have a discussion or debate without logic, reason, and understanding. Now to be frank i dont whine over the line buf it does make me internally cringe when she says it. Im not a big fan of this catwoman in general and for me it was the icing on the cake. Nothing against the actress just i feel as though she doesnt fit the role very well and the costume was pretty atrocious honestly. Good day to you just wanted to share my opinion on the subject


The850killer

It’s just an unnecessary comment for the movie. It feels like pandering. Not to mention white people who grew up poor af find it ridiculous in general. Hollywood never learns from mistakes.


TrainerAppropriate19

I agree with you. I do think a lot of complaining about wokeness is exaggerated. But at the same time I won’t deny that there some movies/shows that try to be too “woke” (Birds of Prey for example). However, Batman was not woke at all. The movie was great and I seriously have nothing bad to say about it.


JimmyPWatts

I still enjoyed Birds of Prey just fine. It’s not a great movie, of course. But that has little to do with it being “woke”. It’s just not a great film


TrainerAppropriate19

Yeah that might not have been the best example but you get what I mean. But at the end of the day, if the writing is good then I don’t really care.


JimmyPWatts

Exactly. Cultural elements du jour have always been a part of movie making. Enjoying movies doesn’t have to mean agreeing with all the messaging. Shit, some of my favorite movies (not necessarily good movies) are ones whose messaging I don’t agree with. So what? Still fun movies.


pdockenson

Movies didn't always get political. Sport wasn't always political. In the past 10 or so years, politics and ideologies get introduced into every medium that is completely unrelated and the worst part is the zoomers eat it up. I need to know where this company stands on this issue. Why the fuck do I care where Johnson and Johnson stands on civil rights? I am assuming they're not racist, its 2022, just make a good tooth brush and we're good. The NFL is a great example. If I wanted politics I would turn to CNN, FOX or CSPAN. I watch the NFL for football.


AlphaMale45LA

Grear movie, woke bs


Puntunz

In my opinion what people are pissed off about is the constant reminder of "the message" It doesnt almost matter anymore how big is the line or how often its said, it just gets annoying how often these "catchphrases" are said in different movies.


DebateSudden

That line was a very small part in the movie. We all agree the politicians and dirty cops were assholes maybe even privileged and that’s how they get away with the corruption. But to say “white privileged” out of the blue is kinda messed up. It’s basically saying they are bad people because they are white, not that they are corrupt and are not putting the cities best interest before their greed. Put any other race in “_____ privileged” and it’s still fucked up. That’s my only gripe. Overall great movie and I hope they make a trilogy or even a live-action serious on HBO


Technical_Scene_7689

Penguin is getting an hbo spin off I hear


DebateSudden

That will be interesting. Can’t wait to see it. I know they already did this with “Gotham” but having a series about Gordon would be neat.


Technical_Scene_7689

It wasn’t a woke movie exactly but it had a cringy woke line, just stops the movie dead for a few seconds. The race changes where initially annoying but they did it the right way. imo Gordon and catwoman where great and I’d love to see them again.


pdockenson

Honestly when it happened in Batman, I was just like wait what. It was an amazing movie and caught me off guard completely. Batman isn't woke at all, but that line certainly was.


[deleted]

Goes both ways. If there was a line about mocking something from the other side of the aisle, they'd be up in arms too. The red and blue people have idiots mixed amongst them.


JimmyPWatts

But there are plenty of movies that do that and it isnt a big deal. Any R comedy movie for example. Every supposedly “woke” comic book movie is now cried about every damned time.


Technical_Scene_7689

It actually makes sense, Those R comedies don’t have an established fan base most of the time so the backlash is minimal of at all. Hell those lines could be expected. People don’t like their cherished stories and characters messed with.


JimmyPWatts

Boo hoo. Dont watch then


Prestigious-Yam-9598

Pretty sure that’s the point, she’s complaining about Batman obviously growing up rich and then drops the white privilege comment outta nowhere. There was no need to add the word white, just as there was no need in making all the crooked cops & politicians white, like all the problems of the world are the fault of white people. It was just unnecessary.


ArmInternational7655

Except literally all the corrupt people so far targeted by Riddler have been white. So it's relevant.


[deleted]

Yeah I don't care either way, as long as the people touting white privledge are okay with hearing black crime.


Constant-Gazelle-255

Pretty based, the people dismissing this as being ok probably would squeal into their HRT and Soi if they heard 13/50.


WallabyUpstairs1496

people are, it's just that people like you get upset when they start to ask the why about black crime, and it comes back to white privilege.


The850killer

Exactly, that world view is completely deluded. The corrupt come in all colors.


WallabyUpstairs1496

/r/bothsidesthesame


Zakizdaman

The problem lies in inserting this language with intent rather than having it be a natural or artistic choice.


ToastedGhostJay

I read all the banter and i am against the anti-white line but that guy went about it all wrong. You cant have a discussion or debate without logic, reason, and understanding. Now to be frank i dont whine over the line buf it does make me internally cringe when she says it. Im not a big fan of this catwoman in general and for me it was the icing on the cake. Nothing against the actress just i feel as though she doesnt fit the role very well and the costume was pretty atrocious honestly. Good day to you jsut wanted to ahare my opinion on the subject


work-edmdg

Try to imagine if the comment was reversed. How would that go over? It would be racist, and the same is true here. So much cringe these days.


minecrafter13004

This, and so many news articles are making fun of people calling it racist saying its reverse racism in a sarcastic tone, but racism is racism no matter how you look at it


pablothenice

> Much ado about nothing Except it is. And she literally said it. Do we have a history of gotham 300 years ago? That line was absolutelly woke.


BrightonBummer

But the same thing would happen if she spouted some conservative talking point, the front page would be covere in it for days telling you its bad and why. This happens to both sides, just one side has far more repsentation in media. Pretty hysterical.


JimmyPWatts

False. Conservative media exists exactly because of this victim mentality. Why do they hate capitalism so much? Media is business.


BrightonBummer

Oh it does, well im glad thats just your opinion mate, they both play the victim when it suits them. I'd say the left more recently over lgbt shit but sure complain about conservatives getting their kids indoctrinated lol, not like theres video evidence of these teachers doing it. Of course you still get your religuous right nutters who do the same thing. See everyone is fucked! So stop defending a party/ideology so hard that doesnt give a fuck about you. What has biden done for you?


JimmyPWatts

See that’s what is hilarious to me in every response to my comments on this thread. I have made no statement in support of anything, I haven’t defended anything, or talked about liking the catwoman line. All i have said repeatedly is that it is classic how triggered people have gotten over one line in a movie. And how hypocritical it is of them to be triggered when for so long they have complained about other people getting triggered over the things people have said. It’s fucking hysterical. And no matter how many times I say it, the triggering just gets ever more hyperbolic. It’s incredible. You just proved my point. Thank you very much.


BrightonBummer

Its not being triggered to argue a point. Triggered is going off on someone from an emotional standpoint. Im glad you find it all hysterical.


JimmyPWatts

Look at the other comments I have responded to. The ones that werent deleted for being soooo emotional. It’s all emotional triggering because of 1 line from catwoman


beaucoups

Dude "concepts of equality" like comon man. In my opinion the line was completely out of place. It's a shitty line cause if you're honest enough bro, it's a racist. Weird for a line like that to be used in a mainstream superhero movie. Don't defend it. People just need to leave race out of the subject.


JimmyPWatts

Here we go again!


pdockenson

Not really, it's pretty simple. Batman should be about Batman, not whatever your political ideology or agenda is. It's a comic book. It's not that difficult to understand. You just did the classic: side X disagrees about opinion Y, all side X does is cry about stuff.


JimmyPWatts

Three months later. This shit is still getting action. Wild


0db1436

I was surprised to hear it, sure... but it tracks with the film. Specifically the "poor white guy" at the funeral & Annika's largely unnoticed death implied a concept about living in Gotham. Zoe's take on Catwoman, who clearly was imagined as a person of color, repeats this already established theme through a lense that isn't utilized often in a real, or fictional, world full of "rich white guys". If I remember correctly, hers is the 3rd iteration on this theme and of course it's going to be through her not rich, non white woman character's voice. My understanding is if something makes you feel strongly in any direction, it deserves some thought on "why". We've all got our blind spots and biases, but as a person of color myself I'd ask anyone who was offended by that line to examine theirs.


TrainerAppropriate19

I am a POC myself. And I don’t believe in white privilege for the most part either. But whether I do or do not doesn’t matter. It’s just one line in a fucking three hour movie.


beaucoups

TY brother


SimplyStomp

I think the problem with the "anti-rich white guy" sentiment is that, while true and somewhat justified, it's often used as a platform to demean white people who are far from rich. The white privilege movement has taken an extremely small subset of the white race and used their privileges as a starting point to belittle the group as a whole. There's plenty of white people living in poverty with very few privileges to speak of, and it is that group that feels the most insulted by the white privilege rhetoric. The real kicker is that it is no surprise that the conservatives are so opposed to the idea. Most conservative areas are more rural with lower monetary standards of living. The average conservative white person is far less privileged than the average liberal white person. The white college educated city liberal identifies their own privilege and prescribes it to the general ethnic population with no regard to nuance.


OptimusChimes_In

I get the concept behind the line, but both the delivery and placement of the line within the script was so ham fisted…


Last_Fan_7616

It was more groan and eye rolling for me, then anything else


SJ1030

What's funny is that she is also talking about Bruce as well not just the bad guys


TrainerAppropriate19

That is exactly why I thought it was funny. But I feel like the joke flew over a bunch of people’s heads.


TheKrustyKurb

Yeah the stare Bruce gave her after that without saying a word lmao


[deleted]

The quote by Cat woman is sort of pathetic. Especially since her white Russian friend litterly just got killed, and no one even cared about her as well... Wasn't that the whole point? The same goes for the villain who is also a white orphan. If it is only the whites in Gotham that are privileged, then why do you also see the white people suffer just as much in the movie, especially around Cat woman as we learn more about her. It makes no sense. It seems completely out of touch with the movie overall and is just a political statement to gain some sort of support from the "real world" activists by putting such a quote there. Maybe that is also why you never saw any villains portrayed by POC in the movie as well.... Funny how that the mayer is also black and must be expected to have a better privileged than Cat womans White russian friend or even "the Riddler" who was also white.


SJ1030

Cat woman never said only whites are privileged. She said the people in power at that time are white privilege assholes which is true in this movie. Riddler was killing them and in her opinion they deserved it. I think people are reaching tbh


TrainerAppropriate19

Definitely. I didn’t know people were this offended about one line lol.


Gabe0697

That just makes the comment even worse. Shows how sad racist people are, and yes, she is being very racist.


keystonedPA

Some chick at my bar ranted for a solid 10 mins about this the other night. Meanwhile I'm over here like, okay princess, show me where The Batman hurt you. Stffffuuuu. People just love being outraged over every single stupid fucking thing nowadays.


TrainerAppropriate19

Right? I was like come on it’s literally just one fucking line.


GateCityGhouls

As a white person who recognizes that white privilege exists, this line was out of left field and didn't pertain to ANYTHING that the plot of the movie deals with. I think that's why it bothers people so much. It felt out of place and forced, like some virtue signaling producer was on set that day and was like "you know what this scene needs?"Pftt, personally I think it needs to be removed from the movie.


AdrianCv9

Yes, aspecaly social justice warriors that make evriting about sex and race


Constant-Gazelle-255

"okay princess", haha typical redditor tranny or femoid response to people being annoyed over anti-white propaganda. You don't mind it because you have serious down-syndrome white guilt.


ChillagerGang

Of batman would have said anything negative about blacks you would have CRIED like a baby


covesquadron

Don’t forget your Saran Wrap (meant as extremely sarcastically as possible)


TrainerAppropriate19

Is this a reference to the movie haha. I’m confused lol.


BerserkGravy

This is funny because only white dudes were the extremists too lol.


AdrianCv9

The line just came out of nowhere and took me out of the movie a bit, even my gf,a black girl, was like "when did that came from". Didn't rly make sense because at no point during the movie anything about race was mentioned. And yes it was funny considering that she was asking for help from batman a trust fund white dude


Constant-Gazelle-255

Any rational person who isn't a leftish robot would have seen how jarring and out-of-place that line was. Obvious modern anti-white propaganda that was just slipped in there. She also obviously knew he was white too, his fucking mouth and jaw are naked.


TheKrustyKurb

I found it funny with the way Bruce just stared at her after that but in general even if other comedies have racist jokes this isn't a comedy and there wasn't really any punch line other than "They're white males" therefore they're privileged. Even if it's ironic it's still just kind of putting too much politics into a movie about a dude in a bat costume fighting crime. Racebending Cat Woman and Commissioner Gordon wasn't a problem for me, worked fine for the characters. But Hollywood was just really trying to pull the left audience. That's fine of course but if batman said something about black people negatively there'd be massive backlash. Even if it's just that one line and it shouldn't affect a movie too hard what if batman said something racist to cat woman or Gordon and none of the characters attacked him for it and kinda just let it slide? That wouldn't be alright and most people would recognize that. But since it was something like this, not many people had a problem with it because of woke culture and the stereotypical privileged white male. Jokes can be jokes and this was pretty ironic which made it somewhat funny, but it still says that hollywood really wants a more woke audience.


animalmom2

Exactly, it was like “well we made all the bad people white, all the good people black, but in order to get our appropriate credentials of the day let’s just spell it out so that nobody can claim they didn’t get it”


Ok-Ordinary-668

I must have been using the restroom when that line was said because I don't remember it. I DO remember her saying "I KNOW you grew up rich" or something like that, which he ignores and then he more or less calls her a prostitute (kind of). lol I wouldn't be surprised if a line like that IS planted in out of nowhere, though. I mean, who can blame them? You gotta preemptively protect yourself from the woke mobs on Twitter. And injecting a little line like that doesn't make the entire movie about some preachy woke message (which, honestly, is extremely annoying when it happens), it is just a line and it gives insight into what is going on in her head as a character. That's not necessarily a bad thing. And it was just one line, so it shouldn't define her entire character. Besides, when we learn about the Riddler's upbringing, we learn he was white and he was far from privileged. And his anger is directed at the rich and powerful, regardless of race. People on both sides of the aisle just like to make a big deal out of these things. Everyone is so sensitive nowadays. When I hear the term "white privilege", it does make me cringe, but I just move on. People say a lot of stupid shit I disagree with. Especially in Hollywood, so I just go in expecting it now. I can still enjoy movies if they are entertaining and not too preachy.


icecreamcake15

I wouldn’t say it made me mad, I still enjoyed the film. It just kinda annoyed me. I want to watch a movie to get away from real world issues/politics. It don’t care if it aligns with my political views or not. Just leave it out.


TrainerAppropriate19

Ok I totally see where you’re coming from. I’m the same way sometimes. But there are a lot of people that felt enraged when Catwoman mentioned white privilege which I found to be very funny.


icecreamcake15

Yea I heard some people straight up walked out of the theater. That’s pretty ridiculous.


TrainerAppropriate19

Yeah exactly. That’s what I was trying to get at with my post. Like if you’re that bothered by that one line then I don’t think you’re there to enjoy the movie. You’re there to find things to get offended by. I guess there’s people on both political sides that get easily offended.


icecreamcake15

Exactly! It’s unfortunate because those are the things people tend to remember more and associate with left/right


Expensive_Lie_8685

can somebody point me to when she says that line?


Vizzeon

I think it was the acene when she told Batman, Fal was her father (?) one of the roof scenes.


Expensive_Lie_8685

yeah i watched the scene back and she says "Whoever you are I can tell you grew up rich" which isn't really that woke honestly. I didn't see any wokeness from the movie. And honestly its just a good film, sad that people let the so-called culture war stop them from enjoying a great film.


Vizzeon

mightve told u the wrong scene but she definitely did say it. regardless I agree, very enjoyable, digestable film. The line just sort of un-immersed some people


Mad4it2

No, I'm watching it now and she says "White privileged assholes". Why even put the word "White" in there? We all know why, don't we. Its totally out of place and unnecessary. Tbh it brought my engagement out of the movie atmosphere and back to just watching something poorly written on my TV.


Expensive_Lie_8685

Yeah I watched again and I was like what? Feels out of character as well. Catwoman didn't really stick with me.


anonimus_riga

I am watching comics based move and dont need to be reminded of real world politics, but it seems Hollywood just cant help themselves. It did not spoil the whole movie, it just did not belong there. Dialog could have same meaning and outcome without "white privilege" in it.


ArmInternational7655

People don't realize how stupid they are. The Waynes, the victims of Riddler, were all literally rich, privileged white dudes. It's not like she made some shit up. Lol she was speaking literal fact.


TrainerAppropriate19

The thing is, I don’t even care if people agreed with her views or not. What was weird was that people simply walked out of the movie because of that one line. And these were the same people that say that the world is too sensitive but get offended by one line.


ChillagerGang

Wtf has that to do with anything???? Riddler and many other white people in Gotham were were very poor


ArmInternational7655

Calling a white person white isn't hurting someone. This fake outrage is getting ridiculous.


maultify

Yet if you flipped that around for another race it suddenly wouldn't be okay. These double standards are getting ridiculous.


ChillagerGang

She specifically said "white priviliged men" like being white is a bad thing


ArmInternational7655

I like how you typed "specifically" then blatantly ignore the context of the statement. Lol she "specifically" said White privilege because her girlfriend, the poor white foreigner, didn't get the same care as those murdered by Riddler. She's literally angry because rich white guys are more cared for than a poor white girl.


Icy_Slap

The problem is that the line diminishes Kravitz's performance. She's not badass "Catwoman" any more she's now badass "Black Catwoman". Her skin color didn't matter until the director decided to turn Black Catwoman into a BLM supporter.


ArmInternational7655

It doesn't diminish anything about the performance unless you're the type of person bothered by the term "white privilege" which already says a lot about a person. The complainers shouldn't be allowed to enjoy the movie anyways if "white privilege" is enough to ruin even a part of it for them. Especially when the "white privilege" line was in character for Selina and entirely accurate. Literally everyone killed by Riddler was white and privileged. The only people the media care about in the movie? White privilege victims; Mayor Mitchell, Commissioner Savage, DA Colson, the Waynes, etc. So her issues were valid. The fact Selina said that because her poor white friend, Annika, was vilified, murdered then immediately forgotten, it kinda nullifies that complaint anyways. She clearly had nothing against white people. Heck, she was interested in Batman in spite of him being white and rich. She even saved him, then asked him to join her.


XZISTTT

Youre stretching quite a bit here. The line is completely out of place, totally jarring and needlessly political.


ArmInternational7655

Late to the party just to be wrong.


XZISTTT

not really


ShiftAdventurous4680

Honestly, I found the line jarring but I may be of a different opinion than others. I kinda wished Catwoman said more of that throughout the film to show a very justified hang-up on her view of society. Someone may say something bad or dislike/hate a group of people due to their limited and traumatic interactions with them so it's not like Catwoman was not justified in saying a line like that. My issue is that she only said it once. So I think, they either should have cut that line, or played it more into her character and development.


OopsyDoopsyMan

I just dont watch a batman movie to be reminded of politics and rhetoric I watch it to escape from that stuff


TrainerAppropriate19

Ah I see, which is fine. But my post was mainly targeted towards the people who walked out of the theaters simply from that one line. And I usually these same people complain about how sensitive the world is but they got offended by one line. To call a movie trash because of one line is a bit extreme in my opinion.


OopsyDoopsyMan

The rest of the movie is about bruce waynes entitlement and how even as an orphan he had it better then the other orphans because he was rich The message was still there and it was perfect, artistic and beautiful but then they had to unsubtly beat me over the head with it like i was too stupid to get it already Its just kinda insulting and not to mention imersion shattering


dawsonblack

I love superhero movies and I’ve come to accept the fact that we have to accept a token “woke” line or scene 1 or 2 times in most of these new movies. Whether it be a scene about race, sexuality, privilege, etc. I don’t care for it but I can get over it because I’m not just going to stop watching these movies. This line felt a little more forced than other scenes or lines did to me though. The women pose in endgame was really cheesy to me, but at least there was some sort of build up so it kind of fit with the movie. This one just came out of left field, and just felt really forced. It took me out of the movie, which is the only reason it bothered me a little. I don’t think it was as big of a deal as people are making it, it was just really weird and took away from what was a great scene


TrainerAppropriate19

I agree with everything you said. While I may not agree with a line, I’m not gonna make a big deal out of it.


dawsonblack

It was just really lame to me. It didn’t fit with literally anything going on in the movie. There wasn’t a single time where I felt that the plot was affected by race. It’s almost like they were trying to throw the line in there to make one party see them as “woke” without irritating the other party, if that makes sense


Kaney199

I find it quite funny, that the "white-privilege ***holes" line didn't create nearly as much uproar as, probably, intended. It's odd to say the least that it was even included in the movie, that in 2020+ someone wrote it meaningfully. It can never just be about The Batman (&/or Co.), there always has to be some underlying message or political interjection. Identity politics or aiding a division of races/nationalities/genders etc. I'm hardly bothered about it, yet it's clear some people (fewer than others) seem to enjoy it and bark nonsense - 'JimmyPWatts' for example. I'd just rather enjoy a good movie. Obviously white-privilege is completely and wholly subjective. Any idiot could figure that out after spending 10 minutes outside of their safe space... Anywho, no one seemed to have added any actual input sooo here I am 🤷 I liked the movie lol


Fantastic_Rabbit_393

It’s a stupid line. The Batman was a great movie but it made no sense as to why Catwoman made it about race. These corrupt people aren’t corrupt because of their skin color, they’re corrupt because they’re genuinely bad people. Anyone who believes in the idea of white privilege is simply being misled and unfortunately has a victim mentality.


Drop_Release

Dude the whole point of the line was the juxtaposition - she said the line about privileged white men - that included people she saw in that group including Bruce Wayne - without realising that Bruce was standing right in front of him and in a way the movie was actually saying that people of privilege can change their perspective and try to do good. It wasn’t about being woke at all but rather a juxtaposition and character moment for Bruce. This was also the moment he opted to stay in Gotham - he realised he could do good as Batman that he may not be able to do as Bruce Wayne due to peoples preconceived notions about rich billionaires


TrainerAppropriate19

Surprised I had to wait so long to see a person with an actual brain comment. I thought I was the only one that got the joke. The punchline was that Batman himself is a rich white guy. So if anything, it was making fun of “wokeness”. I’m surprised one line got so many people triggered.


randomusername7725

You're really reaching on the purpose of that line/similar themes in the movie being that white privileged people can use their privilege to do good. Also I'm pretty sure he opted to stay in Gotham because he realized pure vengeance was meaningless, not because he wants to make billionaires look better 💀


SmartConcept

Well they can use their privilege to do good...the line was still done though to prove how the term itself didn't really make sense.


moonlightcockroach

Hmm, this is an interesting take, but if I'm understanding you correctly, I don't think it works as a juxtaposition. To me, it more serves the purpose to emphasize why the term itself is kind of stupid (though this most definitely was not anyone's intention). The whole thing about the term "white privilege" is that it immediately implicates anyone who is white, disregarding any of the infinite amount of other human characteristics someone may have. She can see that batman is white, so it doesn't really work if she meant to say Bruce Wayne has "white privilege" and not batman, while not knowing that they are the same person. If the intended juxtaposition is two white guys: one that is a rich asshole (Bruce Wayne) and one that is not (Batman), then yea that works fine. However, according to the accepted axiomatic definition of the term "white privilege" by the left, it doesn't work logically to juxtapose one white guy with white privilege and another white guy without it. A person cannot be white and not have white privilege (again, according to the accepted definition). So, "white privilege" would apply to both Bruce Wayne and batman (as well as any other white person) equally. I think this is what a lot of people take issue with regarding "white privilege." Anyway, FWIW, I thought it was a good movie and wasn't triggered by this line. I rolled my eyes when I heard it, while simultaneously realizing that it is totally something I would expect that character to say. I was more put off by the fact that every single black person was morally good and pretty much every white person was bad. Even then, I still liked the movie.


Flinns

Hadn't thought of that way. Solid post.


TrainerAppropriate19

Bruh. You’re the problem. I have the same beliefs as you do but it’s not that deep. It’s just ONE line in a 3 hour movie. And I thought the line was funny because Batman himself is a white rich dude lol. > It’s a stupid line. You could literally say that about any line. The thumb drive line for example. I thought it was funny but it didn’t add anything crucial to the movie.


[deleted]

I’ll be honest, you definitely changed my perspective a bit.


TrainerAppropriate19

Of course haha.


TripleJ_

>Anyone who believes in the idea of white privilege is simply being misled and unfortunately has a victim mentality. TIL that I as a white male have a victim mentality because I "believe" in white privilege, lol.


lingdingwhoopy

Oh look. Somebody who doesn't understand the basic concept of white privilege.


TheLazyDrunk

It’s not a thing.


lingdingwhoopy

Oh but it like, really is. It's not that hard to grasp.


[deleted]

[удалено]


lingdingwhoopy

LOL


bobby1kenobi

I really felt like the line was out of place, especially since she was bringing race up when she didn't get a The Dark Knight script reading. I believe it's her own agenda. I'm willing to bet she wanted that line in there and Matt Reeves allowed it because its bad optics to suppress virtue signaling. Jeffrey Wright smashed it as Jim Gordon though, Paul Dano could of delivered a bit better during the interrogation scene and Pattinson was amazing as a young Bruce/Batman. As soon as that line came from Zoe Kravitz though it kinda ruined her character for me. Shes a beautiful young woman that's a great actor and is interesting enough without divisive talk like that.


Drop_Release

Dude the whole point of the line was the juxtaposition - she said the line about privileged white men - that included people she saw in that group including Bruce Wayne - without realising that Bruce was standing right in front of him and in a way the movie was actually saying that people of privilege can change their perspective and try to do good. It wasn’t about being woke at all but rather a juxtaposition and character moment for Bruce. This was also the moment he opted to stay in Gotham - he realised he could do good as Batman that he may not be able to do as Bruce Wayne due to peoples preconceived notions about rich billionaires


TrainerAppropriate19

She didn’t bring up race. She talked about the issue on Instagram herself saying she never complained about it being about her race. The media twisted it to their narrative like they always do. And it made her look bad. She doesn’t have an agenda against a 14 year old film.


lingdingwhoopy

🤣🤣🤣


skibidido

Cringy. But that's Hollywood.


RegularCelt

I came to the conclusion being; while she's ranting about white privilege, there's a "privileged" white guy standing right in front of her, fighting against the very people she claims to be the problem. KEKW


Degs29

I’m not sure people are angry, but I understand being annoyed. It was an unnecessary addition. Could have just said “privileged”. But nope, had to imply Whiteness played a role. Someone in this thread mentioned those who were upset with it should also be upset if some mentioned Black crime. To which I’d say….yeah! It’s also a dumb thing to say, which would imply Blackness intrinsically conveys a criminal element. What bugs me is the hypocrisy and how backwards that thinking is in either of those cases. To say either is acceptable is an issue.


spookyemperor

Name the last movie you watched where it was implied the villain was a bad guy because of his race


Degs29

Aside from this one, you mean?


AyoSinginChallenge

I lean right as well, not very mad and I don’t think it took anything away from the movie but it felt very forced and odd since she was talking to Batman who obviously is white


TrainerAppropriate19

I thought that was the punchline you know? Since he is white as well but he’s the good guy. I didn’t really think it was that deep.


Stellarspace1234

Yes, they are. There’s always been the group that’s upset by the phrase.


GrandLordMorskittar

It's an anti-white canard commonly used to justify everything from dismissal of one's experiences to real world violence and discriminatory practices against white people so any intelligent white person will not like hearing it perpetuated in popular media.


SnooHamsters5546

It’s not so much the line but every bad guy is white and all the good guys cops included are black. Even Bruce Wayne is made out to be the bad guy. Honestly don’t really care about the politics I just watch the movie. Everyone should know by now that’s how Hollywood is so why even complain


FOXYGAYE81

She basically said Thomas and Bruce Wayne have white privilege. I'm tired of trashing white people. Not all 2hite people are rich amd alot of white people are getting screwed by the government.


MrDravend

Robert Pattison was a horrible batman and an even worse Bruce Wayne. Zoe Kravitz was a terrible catwoman and that other actor who played Gordon was just .... bad. Funny how black people can get away with hate speech of Anti whiteness...and get away with it. No one complains. No one says one God damn word about it.... Billy Porter from Cinderella.the fabulous god mother(what a fucking joke)g0.. openly made claims against "white people" in interviews and he gets zero flak... Yet again. HULK Hogan says nigger 1 time in a private phone call and got his wrestling hall of fame stripped and name removed & black listed from the WWE... There's some agenda bullshit happening in the back ground no one wants to talk about it because God forbid some black people get triggered... People's careers go down the gutter. But it's okay to be racist if your black.. Of course


BlunderbussPole

Yes it is a stupid line that sounds like it was written by a 3 yr old. Not to mention that there is NO SUCH THING AS WHITE PRIVILEGE. It's just more propaganda from the woke left to try and get us all to fight while shady shit goes down. If we need to agree on ANYTHING, Why not GOVERNMWNT PRIVILEGE? There's a term I'm ok with. It checks out. Fuck it


cjarvis_32

My problem with it is that it seems like the only reason catwoman was in the movie was to deliver that line. You could seriously take her out if the movie and it would be basically the same movie. That was why I didn't like it, because it made a useless character feel even more useless


XZISTTT

I dont like the line either but you must be blind. She literally saves batman toward the end of the movie, is the love interest / love side story throughout and on multiple occasions exists so batman can uphold and exemplify one of his core values of not killing people.


cjarvis_32

And her role in saving batman and her existing so batman can uphold and exemplify one of his core values of not killing people could both have been filled by Commissioner Gordan. She was there as a love interest/eye candy, and to deliver a line about rich white people and that's basically it.


XZISTTT

whether some of that ish could be done by another character doesnt necessarily mean her role was useless.. you're basically shifting your position here: agreeing with me that she served a purpose, but that some other character should have instead. i dont disagree with that


cjarvis_32

You're correct, I am agreeing with you and shifting my position because I had forgotten about the need for some sort of romance/eye candy subplot in the movie. So no her role in the movie was not "useless" but it added little to (let's be honest) nothing to the movie. Her parts could have been cut and the movie could have been 15 to 20 minutes shorter. Don't get me wrong, I loved this movie but it's not perfect. And removing catwoman would not have solved ever problem I had either. The main thing I found frustrating, is it seemed like all she was there for was the things we have already discussed, when she could have been used for so much more than that. Again, I LOVED THIS MOVIE but it's not perfect. I've already wasted more time than I thought I would on this topic so I'm done now. Have a good one.


el_hefe2002

What if Batman had called her a bull dyke nigger? Same sentiment. Sorry for the language.


Medical-Measurement8

Tell me if they were black and the line was "those black crackhead assholes." Go figure reddit thinks its ok to be racist against white people only.


Icy_Slap

The line is terrible. It turns "Catwoman" a really badass character played by a cool actress (whose skin color didn't matter at all until that scene) into "Black Catwoman". And because she's POC she's concerned about white privilege (and probably attends BLM rallies). If anything it shows the bias of (white privileged) director Matt Reeves that all black people are one-dimensional SJWs.


feitfan82

Weird thing to hear in a movie where there's only 2 black people.


SimplyStomp

It didn't ruin the movie, but it definitely diminished what could have been a powerful scene with catwoman and batman.


MyForumName

I love hearing a black Jewish actress complain about white privilege. It makes my racism feel justified.


maultify

It was a garbage line that brought me out of the movie.


xyqco

I'm not sure if anybody else saw this, but I found the "white privilege" line very interesting. If you recall there were several scenes in the movie that revealed that the general public's opinion was very much wall street walkout, anti-hedge fund out with establishment. There was the guy in the church during the memorial... the mobs carrying signs... all pointing to the fact that "Bruce Wayne was privileged and did nothing good with it." So when Catwoman also said that Bruce Wayne has white privilege it fell in line with the mob mentality the movie was creating. Batman even almost retires himself and believes it, "Maybe Batman is done." But consider the fact that we are supposed to agree with Catwoman and the mob... All the way up until the point where the Riddler reveals that he was an orphan. A white , underprivileged male orphan. How can we be so blind as to think that all white people are privileged? When I first heard the line it sounded so forced and out of place to be honest. I think it Matt Reeves was bold enough he would have included the word "privilege" in the Riddler's speech at Arkham so a real conversation of what white privilege can mean. It's very offensive to the Riddler to imagine he's privileged, that's why he's destroying the lives of those whom he considers privileged and corrupt. I think Matt Reeves could have been smarter. The issue is that it comes from a black woman's mouth out of the blue and it just doesn't sit right without context. What do you guys think? My random thoughts.


WearyMarch9295

I don't think the issue is it comes from a "black woman's mouth". The entire idea is racist. I've heard the white privilege ideolog come from "white peoples mouths" while disregarding I spent most of my life homeless, and most of my childhood locked up without parents. Believe me when I saw there are way less "white privileged people" than there are "white privileged people" and we are just sick of hearing it. But you want to keep pushing it. It's not going to end well, racist ideologs accepted by culture never ended well once in history. As far as I can tell the sophists have done their job well which is to destroy civilizations from within using fallacies. And so... here we go again


Desertbae

Yup, I stopped watching right there.


Gabe0697

If you find it weird that there is backlash over one racist line in a 3 hours movie, try flipping it around and see if nobody comments on a uncalled for racist comment against the black or asian or some native community. Also from an artistic POV it was rather random and out of place. Kinda stuck out like a sore thumb.


Rockonymous

They liberalized batman. Says enough. The movie sucked.


TheLastCentaur

The meltdown there would be if all the corrupt people were black and the quote was 'Black privileged assholes'. Film would damn near be banned. I knew it would contain more woke nonsense for sure when the first scene with batman fighting criminals is a group of white skinheads pressuring a young black guy to assault a man but he's too good natured to join in. Ask yourself why they chose these races in these roles. There's a pattern with Hollywood movies depicting POC as the noble races and specifically white men as morally dubious/corrupt/insane etc. It's not arbitrary, a specific perception of reality is being fed to people with these films and its very telling that many people don't seem to notice. I'd hope it's because 'race doesn't matter' but would put money down that many people would have an issue with the scene if the races are switched. Reverse that scene in your mind (as in group of black guys pressuring a young white guy) and if it has a heightened valence for you because you think its racist, but you didn't notice anything odd when you watched the scene initially, you're being blindly inconsistent at best.


SmartConcept

It wasn't woke nonsense...it wasn't about race. It's not just white guys pressuring him though. They don't chose these races in these roles. There isn't a pattern like that though, the main protagonist is literally a white guy. ​ Nah with a film like this...a huge perception of reality is being fed to people, and they can see that...it's you that can't notice the truth, not them. ​ No one here is being blindly inconsistent.


ComplaintHoliday4709

I can say from watching the movie for the first time through HBO Max recently that the line feels out of place, and it's stupid...Why bring race into it at all? Why not just say "privilege". This is a fantastical story about a man in a bat suit fighting crime, why are they bringing race into this at all? Not to mention, it doesn't make sense within the context of the story, especially when she cites Gordon who is black in this timeline -- it feels like a line improved by a very liberal actor. It didn't kill my enjoyment of the movie, but it added nothing to it, besides my laughter. A great movie, with some occasionally shitty writing, with the aforementioned being amongst the shittiest examples.


GateCityGhouls

It just didn't make sense to me for her to say it. Didn't really seem to fit the situation lol


GhostNomad141

I dunno. For people who wax lyrical about microaggressions and whatnot, having a protagonist in a movie express support for someone killing people merely because of their skin colour should be a pretty big deal. But what do I know? If this is what Hollywood is up to then it's no surprise the most interesting thing about the Oscars in years is Will Smith slapping somebody.


WearyMarch9295

I'm just tired of these get woke go broke movies overall. It's why I stopped going to movies around 2017. I watched this one because it was a work/team outing the company paid for, and it would look bad if I didn't come. ​ My reason why I basically stopped watching anything past 2017... If some new movie comes out, I'm almost certain to be uninterested in it. Because you can't make any good art these days. At least not in the west. Because the whole point of art these days is to create something enjoyable and beautiful that gets positive emotions running through you to help you to break away from the ugliness of reality such as being yelled at by extremists. Catering to the genuine and deep human emotions is no longer part of art and hasn't been been for a long time. So the idea that I'm going to find something particularly valuable in a movie particularly a modern movie... well no you are just going to get a whole lot of propaganda. None of it will be true. And all of it is going to be well we don't want this special interest group to yell at us and we don't want that special interest group to yell at us and my god we are going to get in trouble if we portray this and we're not going... it's all defensive avoidance of being yelled at or attacked or de-platformed or ostracized or . There's no actual art in the way I would genuinely understand the term going on these days. I just don't think that's a thing at all. So that's not something I want anything to do with or support. Sometimes I'll occasionally dip into art just to see what is going on. But usually it's met with a oh well this is the complete opposite of art as far as I can tell. Everything there is to manipulate you into a politically correct perspective. Because people consume so much media these days that the media has become their empiricism and they make decisions about things in the real world by being programmed by the programming. And once you are kind of awake to life as a whole, it's really tough to take that stuff at all seriously and to find any kind of pleasure in it. It just doesn't hold any vitality for me. It's just really boring and predictable. ​ My thoughts on the batman movie. Nearly the entire thing was played in slow motion(which is probably why it was almost 3 hours long). I couldn't tell if the first batman taking 3 minutes of walking footsteps to enter the doorway was an 80yr man or batman(probably the worst batman entrance I have ever seen) Once I heard the lead police officer sound like something off the godfather, I started laughing in the theater and knew I couldn't take this seriously. The racist white privilege line was the icing on the cake for me. And after hearing the crowd cheer on that line, I began to feel a little scared. But just kept saying to myself, this is a liberal city and normal here.


SmartConcept

it wasn't a racist line though...it wasn't racist at all, and it wasn't about race.


XZISTTT

explain to me how a comment specifically pointing to the race of "bad" people isnt about race


SmartConcept

the entirety of what she was talking about though when talking about the "bad people" wasn't just about their race though, that's what I mean.


XZISTTT

ic so you went from "it wasnt about race" - to "it wasnt \_just\_ about race"?


SmartConcept

More so I always meant that it wasn't primarily about race...race itself wasn't the main focus.


WearyMarch9295

newest batwoman: "All anyone cares about in this place are the **white privileged** a$$holes" You: "it wasn't a racist line though...it wasn't racist at all, and it wasn't about race." ​ I legitimately don't know how to respond to you, so I'll let the internet do it.


SmartConcept

I mean...it wasn't, calling them white privileged was only part of their overall description...not the main focus of their description.


Aj_jss

I think it was a beautiful and meaningful movie with some really good acting and its themes of justice, corruption and hope were thoroughly explored. I don't think it was woke or politically anti-police but the only woke red flag and unnecessary element for me was Catwoman's mentioning "white privileged assholes" as if corruption depended on your race and gender. I can even get over the fact the villains were all white and most good guys were black (Reál, Gordon, Catwoman) and also the portraying of fringy white guys planning to kill the mayor-elect on an anonymous online forum (like the January 6th incident). But Catwoman's line about white privilege was too much cringy wokeness and totally unnecessary.


Truejoe123

I will never watch Batman again... I watch movies for entertainment, not this political crap, left or right


ClamSlam2020

Well that was fun, easy but fun 😂. Hope this was as educational for you as it was me. Another sweaty, greasy, lefty thinking they're witty but ultimately just deflects because their brains can't construct a proper argument seems to be a popular trend with you people and it's funnier than anything you'll ever see at a comedy club. in the immortal words of Mick Foley, "Have a nice day"


No-Reputation2471

isnt she part white? it definitely was an uneeded stupid line and totally took me out of the movie for the next 15 mins after i tried to wrap my head around it


osiam

It’s a terrible piece of dialogue for multiple reasons. One is because the concept of “privileged white men” is entirely unrelated to the world the film exists in, there are no racial issues or prior references to race featured in the film, the concurrent theme touched on is the approaching election, and false promises made by politicians, truth and “unmasking the truth”. Secondly it’s entirely backward and racist, coming from a black woman it pitches this awfully awkward ‘us and them’ thing that strands so far away from the story. It’s a bizarre line of dialogue that is confusing and poor taste, nor is very ‘comic book’ or child safe (as the film is for kids 16+).


doorhandle5

Well I don't know if it's accurate to the comic books, but Gordon is thinly good cop in this movie. He is black, the rear are white. So only the white cops are bad. The black female (catwoman) saves batman at the end. I have nothing against the actor that played Gordon, he did a good job, and I didn't even notice the colour difference until the white priveledge line, which made me notice everything after that and I enjoyed the rest of the movie less because of it. It was an unnecessary line.


Diiiiirty

I am a white guy and acknowledge white privilege is real. I really enjoyed the movie overall. I thought the line was completely out of left field because race didn't come into play at any point in the movie. Felt like really forced "wokeness" and was jarring enough to take me out of the movie briefly while I said, "wtf was that all about?" They're criminals, many of which came from poverty themselves. And if you noticed in the movie, every single scumbag as well as every drug addict and every single poor person, without exception, was a white person. The only black people were the gangster with a conscious in the beginning, Gordon who is extremely competent, and Selina who is extremely competent. White privilege didn't really seem to exist in this world until Selina forced it into existence. Edit: forgot about the politician who is an extremely competent "for -the-people" mayoral candidate.


JamesZ32

Mostly just people sick of hearing about it. There’s wealth privilege, that’s it. Personally still loved the movie but so eye rolling


AutomaticWait3511

Awesome movie, the line is mildly annoying. I thought that it was largely irrelevant and was just a little appeasement to the woke crowd


Mean_Juggernaut_6179

Maybe because it's racist. Oh but that's ok if it's against whites these days


Technical_Scene_7689

It was forced and out of place, it made no sense for her to say it. You can have an opinion but yes it’s annoying and cringy if you force it.


spattybasshead

I found it out of place and objectively a double standard. Flip the line to saying “Arab privileged assholes” or “Jewish privileged assholes” and you’ll think “whaaaat???”


Sweaty-Fix-4209

the problem i have with the line she said and even the line in general is that apparently any white person that is doing even decent is apparently privileged, in this case a “white privileged asshole”. It’s a very unnecessary and racist thing to say.


fffoookkkaaa

I love The Batman movies. I love the character and the theme of the movies. not to mention the real fight of actors to master the iconic batman profile and way of thinking (the investigator and the billionaire). the LAST thing I expected or thought of was anything remotely related to anything related to race or sex! everything was perfect. and then the Catwoman just had to say that. I really don't understand why would they ruin the momentum. it really felt weird and out of place. I opened online to check because I knew I wasn't the only one really bothered about it. I really wasn't. I'm not upset or angry or anything. but why?? the movie was going perfect, why would you put that line in it. it had NOTHING to do with what was going on. I really am curious. the actors were perfect for their roles especially Andy Serkis and Jeffrey Wright and those two roles really mean something to me in the batman movies as Alfred and inspector Gordon. now what do I have to think? did they just pick Jeffrey wright because he's black?? and did they not put him as Alfred because they don't want to put a black man as Alfred?? that chain of thought really kicked in after they mentioned color in the colorless idea of batman and the bad guys. order vs chaos. and now what started as that turned to black suffering and goodness vs white privilege. it was uncalled for and ruined a good plot and for people who are genuinely mad or upset.i understand how you feel because batman is my favorite superhero. but in the end od the day this is still a movie. you can still choose not to watch it. this won't make you (nor i) feel any better, but there are still good batman movies/ideas out there. hopefully they won't do that again.


IDickHedges

It’s shows her immaturity as the character, impulsive, etc; you see her do the same thing by showing up at the drug bust. Seems to be her just lashing out her father. Kinda ironic complaining about white dudes then kisses white dude.


Dantacular

Nah im not angry by it. Im in fact left leaning but i didnt like the line. Im not mad about it, it just felt wildly out of place to me. But thats ok, not every line can be great and its not gonna piss me off.


THE_RING_BUSTA

Of course the movie went woke like all Hollywood movies do now. Black woman politician standing up for the good. Gordon is now black and his Hispanic underling is also not corrupt, though the baddies are all white men. The white privileged men line was disappointing. Why can’t movies just be movies instead of bringing politics into question? It’s so distracting!


Gozubaka

It's just not needed. saying "Privileged assholes" would have been enough. ​ The establishment is a mixed bag of people from all races, even if the ratio is skewed. Blame the legacy but leave the colour-focused callouts at the door. Individuals make individual decisions and this is NOT programmed into the colour of their skin. Just not needed, it fuels the fire, swings a pendulum of hate. This goes both ways ad infinitum. ​ Break the cycle...


jRobotq

The comment seemed forced. It was definitely out of place. It is a political topic not 100% agrees with. Everyone believes in light vs. darkness, evil vs. good, and justice, but "white" privilege is not exclusive to bad guys. Placing whiteness under the same umbrella of the bad guys is distasteful.


No-Year6583

It just didn't seem needed imo


Insanus_Vitae

Yes. Gotham is a fictional world with fictional characters and there was no logical reason to inject that one single line into the movie. None. The entire movie was an isolated story that was doing really well remaining isolated, but it seems like Zoe Kravitz alone decided to put that single line in. And for what? "Awareness?" Come on, we see all the "awareness" every single day online and in conversation with other people. We go to a movie specifically to enjoy a fictional movie, one where we can enjoy something other than reality for a few hours, and it's really not fair to force people to think about their own lives or the current state of affairs when watching a fictional movie.


Delerium_1975

I am watching The Batman right now, and that line just totally took me out of the immersion. Up until that point, I was really happy to see a movie devoid of any political messaging, but I sort of feared that Catwoman would let something cringeworthy slip from her mouth eventually. Looks like I was right. Yes, it's just one line, and by now we are so used to hearing stuff like that, it should be relatively easy to brush off. My gripe with it is that it's just so unnecessary; it adds nothing to the plot or the movie experience as a whole, and only serves to diminish Catwoman's character to a mouthpiece for currently popular leftist sentiments.


Hambeggar

Yeah because it was ridiculously out of place while she's busy looking at a white dude...


crusty_dog

Woke holly wood getting their greasy litte fat fingers into everything and ruining it. What's ironic is that Zoe's parents are both half white. Was enjoying the movie up until this point but these woke self loathing idiots had to ruin it


fantasticmrsmurf

Why even mention skin colour in a movie about a vigilante crime fighting crusader? What relevance does it have? Flip the script to “these bl*ck some thing something” and watch people get out their pitchforks and torches… Mic drop 🎤 Edit* “these rich as holes bla bla” would have been the correct line to use. Nuff said Edit** “All anyone cares about in this place are the WHITE, privileged a**holes.” Is what was actually said - no need for it at all. Zero relevance to the movie, it is racism. Plane and simple. If you don’t think it is then you’re delusional.


PeteJudge

Who cares if a bunch of inbreeding meth users got mad cuz a beautiful, rich, skilled black woman told the truth? :)