Games Workshop Bans all 3rd Party 3D Printed Parts in their Tournaments?
By - Scholea
Tau40k will still encourage players to enjoy their hobby in any and all ways they see fit.
At least have a bits buying service then, GW.
Don't make us buy 9 commanders just so we can kit out a 3 man crisis team with CIB's
I remember joking about this a while back... It would now cost me $1050 NZ to run 3 triple ion crisis suits legally in a GW tournament. I know they like money over at GW but really?
Judging by recent releases they seem to have learnt their lesson on this one and only let units use weapons that are in the box. Hopefully that means a weapons sprue like the cadian head sprue for our suits.
I have a feeling they're more likely to just restrict weapons options to what you could run out of the box. The weapon sprue would be nice, but I do wonder how much of a price increase that would justify to them...
A shitload. My company makes plastic hardware for aquariums; filters etc. A single injection mold, just the mold, can run anywhere from 10K to 70K. That doesn't count designing the models, designing the sprues, cost of plastic, labor, and so on. I think they call it 40K because that's what a single box costs them to implement, LOL!
I fear you're right but a crisis team with basically 1 of each option would suck so hard that I'm not sure they could get away with it lol.
Plus they don't have to include the weapons sprue really. Just sell it separately for like a fiver.
Sell it separately for a fiver, meanwhile a pack of 2 tactical drones is over $15.
Unless you use services (the jedi) GW doesn't wish you to know.
My group doesn't really worry about WISIWYG for play, so I don't have to worry there, but GW does need to offer a bits service if they are going to require that in their tournaments.
I feel like while they may drive down unique 3rd party bits this is going to increase the number of recasts of already produced miniatures
CIB are $1.20 a piece from my recaster :D
Every time I feel bad about using recasters, I remember CIB and Reaper Chaincannons are 1 per box. Fuck em.
Aye, I am getting some CIB's printed by my BIL. I wasn't planning on entering gw events anyway lol
There used to be a bits catalogue a decade or so ago, it would be nice for them to bring that back
Nah just go to u can only use the gear setup it came in box with (messing btw)
Non *commercially available* 3D printed parts. I wonder what that means for freely distributed parts
same, they aren't going to bother.
So if I get me a printer, download a file and make a few changes to it, it will be my own file, which I can then even prove...ok? Still stupid. I just got me CIBs for a unit of crisis, and 3rd party Viking bits for my Wolves...
Cool, so my second printer is coming in soon.
3D Printer goes brrrrrt
Am I allowed to use greenstuff?
Yes? So I can 3D print molds and press greenstuff bits?
No? So no fixing gaps in fucked up models?
If you design the molds yourself and don't distribute them then you can though lol.
Even if the 3D mold it is not created by me, the model "cast" from it would be.
So I created the model and I did not 3D print.
The rules don't say no 3d printing. I can design something and print it as long as I don't distribute it.
Also that's a very loose interpretation of you creating the model, that as a 3d designer I would very much argue against.
I mean, i literally made an xv8 torso stl (using an older model's stl as base, looks nothing like it used to), does this count ? Its just a weird way to link green stuff kitbashing and allow home created stuff i guess.
That's absolutely fine. It's no difference from green stuff molding the torso copying it and then making changes on that which has been going on for years.
At its heart this ruling is fairly easy to understand. They're cool with people being creative and modifying their own stuff but that leniency stops as soon as you try to make money off it.
And tbh as much as it sucks I can kind of see where they're coming from. They use the tournaments to promote everything warhammer, why should they promote other companies and creaters for free on their official streams etc?
Yeah I’ll let you know if my buddies and I ever see a tournament. Until then, maybe this will drive down the price of third part 3D printed bits?
Remember when GW promoted conversions and kitbashing?
People keep telling me how the current GW is supposedly better than the old GW but I really don't see it.
Also, this basically only punishes conversions as any decent recasts will be indistinguishable once painted.
The current GW isn't better. There is just a bunch of diehard fanbois who would buy GW branded toilet paper and only use that to wipe their ass if GW told them too.
Also Ive been noticing that there are some people who religiously defend GW on Reddit.. I'm guessing they are employees paid to defend GW on social media because no sane human would be putting out these comments.
I'd say it depends on what you're comparing. GW during third and fourth was great: the codexs features kitbashes and conversions with guides, they sold individual bits, and their stores had multiple staff who were interested in running events. That was certainly the golden era of GW for me.
Current GW is nowhere near that, but they have taken huge steps up from where they were in sixth and seventh. To me it seems that they recognized the direction they had been going was terrible, and actually made some effort to change. The game functions better, they engage with the community better, and they actually promote their upcoming new products rather than hide everything until the release date.
Basically, current GW is clearly not as good as they were back in the day, but they're actually taking decent steps to not be the complete shit heap they were in sixth and seventh.
I'm not one to religiously defend GW, but in general, I do think people bitch and bellyache about them too much. It comes out the most around reveal events, when anything short of a full simultaneous Tyranid, Guard, and Eldar refresh is taken as some kind of personal insult. I also am not impressed by the rationalizations people offer around recasting and 3D printing duplicate bits. I don't particularly care if you do those things, but don't lay that shit at GW's feet. I'm not going to join you, cancel my Forgeworld order, and go buy some diesel-scented knock-off from China out of some vague bullshit principle you tell yourself to not feel bad about cutting content creators out of the loop. Just print those CIBs or buy the recast Hazard Suits or whatever and keep it to yourself.
My own personal gripe with GW is that they should do more to encourage the Poorhammer side of the hobby. GW have gradually done away with a lot of the on-ramps young fans have to participate in all aspects of the hobby. The easiest avenue for new players is often Kill Team, which I'd definitely like to see be better supported. The unwillingness to offer a really great digital tool to track rules and updates also limits young fans who can't crank out cash for every rule book, supplement, and update that comes along. I've got a job and disposable income now, but I didn't when I first discovered 40k.
I suggest you read the comments on the post "It was only a purity seal" on warhammer40k subreddit.. Guys getting kicked from shops for having GW plastic kitbashed on other GW plastic.
Yeah, I saw all that. Those stories are so far from my own experience that I'm a bit skeptical.
Nice thing about the US is that gw stores are irrelevant. Little closets with one table, who'd ever want to play in there?
The ork bike bits on space marine bike one was ridiculous. Sounds like the store manager had some serious vendetta.
I believe we call this rule “controversial” lol
Also, "hard to enforce"
This has been the case for ages? Just that before 3d printers it was a case of "you can't bring that 3rs party thing and claim its a GW thing"
Not quite. As long as the model was >80% GW (forgot the exact number), it was ok. So if your crisis suits had, say, 3rd party CIBs because of the limited availability of the GW bit, you were cool. Or if you put a custom head on your fire warrior shas'ui to tell him apart. Not anymore.
I see so many different "at least x% GW it's ok" that I'm pretty sure there never was a rule at this point and that was just what store reps were saying to get you in the door to buy more minis.
I've heard stories of GW employees getting angry if you mention magnetizing, as if GW hope you buy approximately 50 Crisis Suits for every loadout.
You mean you *aren't* buying a crisis suit, new in box, for $25/ea at $75 for three instead of getting the ones from a start collecting set and plastic-gluing every single potential combination of wargear and equipment so you have every option ready to go?
Fortunately 3d printers go brrrrrrrtttttt
I recently got a 7day ban from my areas Warhammer Facebook group because the admin is a GW employee. I suggested the poster use automotive spray to prime the models because he ran out of spray paint. The admins excuse for my ban.. please don't recommend non GW products on this page
Wonder if they'd ban you for mentioning sand... They do sell sand, the ludicrous bastards.
I really hope an open source grimdark miniatures game can take off at some point. I've thought about doing it for Games Workshop and WotC products on and of for decades now...
If nothing else, it always made me suspicious that nobody ever seemed to know how the X% was supposed to be calculated. Like, if this was an official rule, were GW stores measuring custom minis by weight or volume or something to determine the percentage that was GW original parts?
That conjures up a wonderful picture of someone spending longer than a standard game to do the maths to find out what percentage of a model was GW product.
So 80 bucks worth of wargear to kit out a 25$ model in a unit of possibly 9 of them.
I guess how can they prove once painted that something is 3D printed if it’s a replica of a part?
This seems like the stupid downside of their decision, it just means people have more of a reason to print exact copies of GW parts/models so they can just tell them they are GW. Unless they start asking for receipts for every part.
Why wouldn’t they? They are not organising tournaments from the goods of their hearts but to give you a reason to buy more plastic crack
Because they don't make bits readily available to buy from them. e.g. The only way we can get CIBs is the commander kit. And you get one per kit.
Yep and if we unfortunately follow on from a lot of other factions we'll go back to only being able to take 1 CIB or 1 AFP on Commanders, causes that's what's in the box.
GW are a miniature production company that produces rules for the plastic it sells, it will change the rules to save/ make money.
I agree with you, but man it would be nice if the plastic company sold the kind of plastic I liked.
Could you imagine if you could just buy the weapons you needed? Like order 12 cyclic ion blasters and 8 missile pods? I don’t get why these guys aren’t doing that.
Used to be able to be able to order bits, but that makes them less money than restricting availability.
Nah, they only did that for the metal pieces, because they could be molded individually. That's not possible with their plastic sprue technique.
I’ve just been building a couple of commanders and was wondering if they would do that in our 9th codex or restrict the CIBs and AFP to commanders only as none are included in the crisis suit kit.
It used to be Commander exclusive, and they were prototypes so only one weapon in the entire army.
That makes sense. Thanks, I didn’t know that as only got into the game recently.
Btw, I really want a AFP for my killteam and don't want to just sub a missile launcher... Do you know where one can find such a file.
You get one AFP and Cyclic ion in the Crisis Commander kit. It’s a holdover from when they were prototype weapons being ‘tested’ before being deployed to the entire army. Alternatively as people are saying here 3D print them or buy from a 3D printing website.
Side note: How long are pathfinders still going to be testing rail and ion rifles for?
Well there are two sniper units in the army. Although from reading other posts it seems the snipe drones aren't worth their point costs. I think they are neat looking. It makes sense to embed the snipers in the pathfinder though. I'm confused as to what you are after though.
The rules have been opened to allow crisis to take up these other weapons and I don't want a commander battle suite, so I'm not spending 50$ for one little piece of plastic. I don't think they need to change the entire crisis box as that's money redoing molds. As said here they just need weapons boxes like the two drone box you can get (although even that is expensive... I bought the crisis box because it came with six drones and I wanted one suite for later for killteam for flexibility)
There's definitely all the weapons on thingiverse.
There is a reddit sub that should lead you on the path to a lot of stls
Well you just explained it yourself. You’ve gotta buy and expensive pack for a single piece which is just extra profit for them. So yeah, ban 3D printed pieces = profit. GW is not a “good company” that wants you to have a nice hobby. They want to milk you for every penny you’ve got. Same reason they got rather short cycles in between rule set generations compared to pen & paper games. Plus, you can buy the Xenos codex before your armies codex drops a bit later down the lane, you gotta pay twice man, it’s the rules.
Wasn't it always the case ?
How can they tell something is a recast just by looking at it?
That's why this thread is so silly lol. GW has always had a variation of this rule, and stuff like CIBs and whatnot won't be noticed.
They can't. Even some "finecast" legit thing can look shitty compared to recast or a good 3d print.
It's a rule that will only be enforced if you go around announcing it was 3d printed. As long as your not pushing your luck on purpose no one will care.
Guarantee you that a fuckton of models at a tournament will have non-GW commercially available scenery on the base, are we going to enforce this unilaterally, or only on the weapons that GW does not provide in the boxes for models that can take them?
Tau weapons are probably safe. You can't tell that you didn't make them yourself. Any CIB I designed would look identical to a CIB I bought because all CIB look the same. I can't imagine any GW staff trying to argue my CIBs must be 3rd party purchases because they look like the GW model.
Not to deviate from tau but necron flayed ones are 60$ cad for 5 models.... A full squad of 20 is 240$+tax (271.20$).... Like... Yea no.
Yah, these rules won’t last long.
Anyway, back to tabletop simulator.
This pisses me off and I’ve never played at there hq
Thats kind of like being pissed there's no Coke machines at the Pepsi plant. The reason is pretty obvious.
I disagree, if I were to design Pepsi plant I'd put a Coke machine there. The taste speaks for itself.
If they'd have Coke plant, tho, Pepsi would be banned off premises.
yea can't allow a better product to compete :D
Tfw White Dwarf showed a person how to kitbash an ork buggy out of a stick of deodorant.
Well, unless you were planning on playing in these tournaments, it doesn't affect you.
You know, this makes me want to design full suits more now than individual bits.
I'm already pissed about the crappy rules and our model/unit selection drying up, this is just the sprinkles on the cake.
This also means, no one can use the old Shadowsun model too, or a debased new model, giving an already weak unit even less cover.
So we have to buy more models to paint for correct Sept colors for every time they change their mind which sept is going to be the meta. Written by people who dont give a F about our Faction. What about custom septs? You cant use an official sept colors using it, or are they just not allowed either?
They are purposely alienating their customers for their own greed.
And I bet they are working on closing all 3rd party bit makers right now.
FY Games Workshop. FY.
Unless you're suggesting GW might start enforcing Sept colours as their next piece of shittery, it's never mattered what colour you paint your Tau.
No, that’s incorrect. Very commonly misinterpreted, though. The rules are - and have been for a while - that if you have painted a detachment as Tau or FSE that is what you have to run them as. But it doesn’t quite follow the other way.
You can run any non-canon chapter/sept/regiment as whatever you want but the idea is that if your opponent sees a detachment in FSE colours, sporting FSE iconography, then they should be able to count on them being FSE.
Note that that doesn’t just mean “Red Tau must always be FSE” or whatever, but exactly where the line is between “red Tau” and “Painted as Farsighted Enclaves” is, I guess, to be taken on the facts
Can you post a picture or link to that? I know you have to be able to easily differentiate between detachments but Tau have always had dress colours and wartime colours. Tau's Sept colour is white, and Farsights grey? Whilst most none Tau players won't know that.
Okay. But so far I have seen zero official gw announcement of this policy and only this grumpy video circulating around saying “what if they do this”. So. Come back with an actual official gw rules sheet or pdf and verify that this is going to be a thing enforced anywhere except gw stores and headquarters. Was this in effect at the Atlanta Open? Or are we just panic mongering?
People do that for space marines already. Painted them as ultramarines because it's the most common colour but wanna try out blood angels style of gameplay. People will refuse to allow it because they are painted as ultramarines.
Their tournament, game, and rules.
And the result will be that even fewer people will care about GW tournaments.
Why would they care?
Gw tournaments exist as advertisement for their models. The want to be able to make articles about winning armies that show of pics of the minis and talk about the faction including painting and lore to generate hype. All of these rules exist so that tournaments provide a better showcase for the winning armies. If the tournament doesn't get them advertising material there isn't much point having it.
Remember when GW put custom GW employee made armies in white dwarf and have kitbash tutorials...
Now they are more money hungry then EA. Alteast you can play EA Games without their loot boxes.
I'm willing to bet the amount of people they'd lose over that is very small.
I doubt really anyone who wanted to go suddenly won't because of this rule. If you're planning on going to a GW-hosted tournament, you should expect not to use 3d printed pieces.
Im still gonna rock up to local tournaments and say my friend gave me spare cib's from his own collection, fuckers wont notice anyways cause im the only tau player in my store group willing to do tournaments im pretty sure :P
I hope this doesn't apply to Warhammer stores.
I'm not going to put in the effort for this (or play in a tournament, for that matter) but I'd like to paint my army in a Vior'la white scheme, but with the Enclaves sept colors, just to get a reaction out of the tournament organizers.
This is nothing new and has been on the T&C's of the website for a while, what's all the fuss?
"You cant buy Mcdonalds at Burger King" - Lord bakington
(Tau player - 4k points and counting, competitive player)
Everyone’s all up in arms over this. The last GW tournament I went to was in like 2006. They hardly run any. How many of us are gonna pop over to Warhammer World for a tournament? If you live near there, sure, it’s a big deal, and it sucks for you, and I’m sorry. But I’m in the US and this affects me exactly zero. And I just don’t understand why so many people give a shit.
they have 3 US tourny's this year, they are starting back up.
Three? There are more than three independent GTs within 100 miles of me. They have a long way to go before they come close to ITC
Would kit bashing still be legal ?
Say if I took legs from an official imperial guard box and combined them with official fire warrior upper bodies , weapons and helmets. And then called then Gue'vessa , but used a fire warrior stat block for them.
None of the parts are 3d printed , every part of the model is made by citadel , and no advantage is being sought in terms of game play. Would this setup be legal?
You would have to clear those with the tournie organiser first.
This does not affect me or my play group at all, as we play at home and a local game store and all the tournaments we attend are not GW sanctioned and don't care about this "rule".
Same here I think this is absolutely ridiculous but I have never nor will I ever play in any GW tournaments. My friend group also gives no shits if you use a 3rd party bit. It feels like to me people will just buy more recast of current models instead of buying wonderful 3rd party bits. Sometimes I wonder what smooth brain is posting some of this shit from GW.
Time to buy 20 commander boxes.
The thing that amuses the the most about this is that, as written, even printing off bases you've purchased stls for is banned. Or a barrel.
Also, I don't think this is new. They've had similar wording for a long time.
Hopefully GW makes CIBs and airburst thingys really bad in 9e
Pssssh, like I give a damn about official tournaments. Playing local people is way more fun because those people don’t follow the meta, and neither do I.
Long live the Warpguard.
So the best way to get around the 3D printing requirement is to bring a picture of your 3D printer with you then?
You couldn't have bought the bits if you literally own the printer. Them trying to prove you didn't make it would be near impossible, but you could take a picture of the 3D model in Blender on your computer just to prove them wrong too.
Just had a bit of trouble with a store owner in my gaming group. I made 3d printed parts for my tausuits so I'd for example be tournament allowed and don't have any intention to sell them or declare them as my invention. The problem that he had, saying it's a license infringement, stems from my statement for the in universe company I made up that they would tell the price after inquiring.... The lesson here is don't write "ask for prices" anywhere near ur altered miniature even when u follow it up with a joke the inquisition gets it for free.
But aren't all third party products that go directly on a miniature then license infringements?
No 3D Printed parts, but nothing to stop you from 3D printing a mold to make stuff out of modeling clay.
Oh no, imagine not being able to play at the zero events GW runs in my city