T O P

Cost of cigarette in Europe

Cost of cigarette in Europe

indianamerican1

A little surprised by France. Then again maybe my stereotype is exactly why they taxed it.


Ju-Kun

Yep, they taxed it to stop people from smoking, it's kinda working tbh


Kolja420

[It worked from 2016 to 2020](https://media.lesechos.com/api/v1/images/view/60ae1e483e454657f8546426/contenu_article/image.jpg) but the numbers are increasing again, especially among the poorest.


carbartar2

2020 was probably pandemic effect. Still a sharp drop since 2016.


Kolja420

Actually you can see the curve starting to flatten for males (in red) before that. Obviously covid didn't help, but it's probably not the only cause.


carbartar2

You can see the 2018, 2019 and 2020 point. 2019 was the lowest. It went up in 2020.


RadRhys2

Does France have anti-tobacco ads? Do they ban flavored cigarettes? Both of these were pretty successful in the US, especially among children.


Kolja420

Flavored cigarettes were banned last year apparently. I'm not sure about the ads. I know the price increase has been criticized as being too slow to have an effect, it would have worked better if it had been more brutal.


ikkinomi

You right but there is another way 100% legal to make your cigarette taste like before. Now you can buy official brand cigarette with a hole in the filter then buy a capsule to put it on, there is so much menthol in it that some ppl feel the nicotine rush like never before. Good for the lungs /s Total nonsense but tobacco manufacturers found the way to pass it out. I quite smoking in 2007. When I saw my friend "preparing" his menthol cigarettes with this new kind of caps, I tough he was preparing a fix.


luigman

Or take the Australian route and mandate that all the packages have images of black lung and cancer


sqarin1

It’s already like that. Also I know in France the packages are not allowed to have any branding.


luigman

Ah nice, TIL!


Causemas

I think in most places packages are like that, with various disgusting medical images.


Responsible_Zombie_1

Ypu dont need ads you need lobbing


oiseauvert989

Hopefully its just a temporary effect with people being bored during covid shut downs and numbers will start to improve again.


Boris_The_Johnson

Apparently the increase in price actually doesn't stop people that already smoke, however it does stop people from starting


oiseauvert989

I can see that yeh. People who are hooked already know its terribly bad financial decision but its very dificult to stop. People who havent yet started moght be put off though and to be hinest thats probably most important


DreamSensitive6595

In fact there are more young people starting than before with vape products and heated tobacco


radders85

If people want to smoke, let them! …or at least be equal about it and inflate the price ten-fold of junk food for fat fucks!


EyedMoon

Lockdowns were a special time. I think we can expect the number of smokers to start dropping again after Covid (if it exists). Not super quickly, but at least the recent increase should be negated in a few years


oiseauvert989

Haha so sensible until the parentheses and then it just became...strange. It sounds like you questioned the existence of covid in a comment to a person with a relative suffering from covid right now and unable to breathe unaided. Or where you just questioning if covid will ever fade sufficiently for there to be a real post covid? That at least we can still say is an unknown.


sstrange133

I’ll be honest I think he was referring to if covid will ever actually end, but who knows.


oiseauvert989

Yeh im hoping so. Otherwise that would be fully delusional and really quite offensive to patients. I think youre right. Its just written in a funny way.


scrufdawg

> (if it exists) You question whether or not Covid actually exists?


EyedMoon

If "after covid" is something we can expect ;)


tinyoddjob

Sorry to be a downer but covid is never going away


ChaiseEtTable

They tax it to get more money on peoples addiction. Everyone in the South go to Andorra or Spain to buy cigarettes


blackstafflo

How dare you insinuate that a democratic government could tax addictions affecting massively poor populations for anything else than helping them fight it? Now, if you can excuse me, I need to go tighten laws on these disgusting gambling establishments, I heard they were unfair competition to our totally well meaning national lottery. /s


widowdogood

In US they go to Indian reservations.


JakobeBryant19

And Canada. I legit buy them by the zip lock bag. Sketchy ad tbh


Ju-Kun

Yeah i know i'm from Toulouse, and also everyone near Luxembourg goes there to buy cigarettes as well, but it's just for people close to borders otherwise it makes it more difficult for people to buy some and when you look at the stats less people are smoking since they put the tax higher


DreamSensitive6595

Not at all we provide our tobacco from abroad..


Ju-Kun

Only on the boarders otherwise most people still buy them in normal tabaco shops


PyroTech11

I don't get where the stereotype comes from but a weird coincidence happened where I was in Cardiff Wales and I happened to be walking behind these two people and as o got closer i could smell the tabacco and it reminded me of being in France. I walked past them and funnily enough they were speaking French it was so weird.


scrufdawg

Stereotypes exist for a reason.


lexvi1

Finland should be green


Paramite67

is something costing less than 10€ in Finland ?


McTwiszt

Coffee can be really cheap and buckets are for free.


MatiMati918

1€ cheeseburger from mcdonalds


vanjuli

1,10€ actually


MatiMati918

Debends. Small packs cost around 8-9€ and large ones around 10-11€


mapkris

I’d probably just show the actual cost in each country and color code it with a single color scale with various degrees of transparency or a multicolor scale. I don’t really see the point in grouping into three groups.


carbartar2

Well, they used 3 price points. Under 2, 2-10, and over 10. But your proposal would be much more informative and more visually pleasant.


mr_bugurtius

Today in Ukraine average price for cigaretes is more then 2 euro. There are some cheaper but most of them are cost 2.1-2.4 euro


Pr_Quantum

Soon enough you’ll need a new colour for “more than several kidneys” and it’ll only colour France


indianamerican1

Interesting. I was quite surprised by France actually. Is it a case of a the government wanting to be a nanny state and stop people from smoking? EDIT: I didn't say it was a bad thing, I do actually think that tobacco usage should be disincentivized. Maybe I shouldn't have said "nanny state", I just couldn't think of another term to describe it. My point doesn't seem to have come across very well.


Pr_Quantum

Exactly, also you can make a hell ton of money from taxing cigarettes a lot AND save some by making less people needing the social security for lung cancers


TheMAINKUS

No you don't make a hell ton of money from tobacco, that's a lie. Health problem due to smoking cost immensely more money. Even with a pack of cigarettes at 10€


Pr_Quantum

I know cancer isn’t cheap to treat that was a joek but I do believe we make quite the amount of money from taxing cigarettes


TheMAINKUS

And it is wrong. In France, in 2020 the sale of tobacco brought in 16 billion to the state, however the health costs DIRECTLY related to tobacco, were 26 billion. Tobacco has never been profitable! https://www.reseau-hopital-ght.fr/actualites/patients/campagne-d-information-prevention/120-milliards-d-euros-par-an-le-vrai-cout-du-tabac-et-le-prix-fort-pour-la-sante-publique.html


Pr_Quantum

I mean at no point did I stated that taxing tobacco was a profit, I said it made a hell ton of money, and 16 billion is a lot of euros. Like I'm sure I could buy a small country with that much money.


carbartar2

IIRC, some research is showing that smokers might not increase costs much in the long run. They die earlier so they have fewer years of their old age where they require more and more healthcare. So expenses per year alive go up but it's mostly or all offset by having fewer high cost years in later life.


pentacz

why not save hell ton of more money and just organize social security as e.g. vehicle insurance - everyone pays for himself?


Pr_Quantum

Because our state gives a fuck about our population not dying


pentacz

why then not tax sweets and fastfoods like tobacco and ban private cars as it's the most dangerous way of travel?


Pr_Quantum

I mean I think we have higher prices for food high in sugar, fast foods are strictly regulated on what they put in their products and cars are almost banned in Paris Edit: the sugar tax only exists on drinks


FalconTurbo

Oh boy, come to Australia. More than double the price for twenty Marlboros - $26.29US.


ISimpForChinggisKhan

Good


FalconTurbo

Agreed. I'm happy, means a lot fewer chainsmokers everywhere.


Aloonatron

I wonder how much this has helped reduce smoking in the UK too. For a long time people from the UK would go to France to buy cheap cigarettes but if they are expensive there too then that plans out the window. Out of interest how much is a pack of 20 Marlboro Reds in France? Here it seems they are around £12.25 / €14.45.


Pr_Quantum

10.50 €


Aloonatron

Bargain!


GreatScotRace

I live in the U.K. and smoked for almost 10 years, the only reason I stopped smoking was because of the price... I was paying £10+ a day for 20 cigarettes, since I stopped smoking 4 years ago i have saved £12k (I wish I had they savings in physical cash!)


TerraLord8

But how much did you lose :(


Timeeeeey

Its almost like those policies work


GreatScotRace

Not a soul has disputed that haha


radders85

Doesn’t mean it’s right though! If I want to smoke then that’s on me, educate me on the risks, fine! Ban me from smoking indoors…ok, I don’t want to put others at risk! Put horror imagery on the packaging…bit fucking psychotic, but fine! I shouldn’t have to pay extortionate prices to do so though! If that’s the case though, put scales at the entry of supermarkets/fast food places and charge fat fucks a premium for junk food too etc


Causemas

Doesn't sound like a bad idea tbh. /s But some mild form of regulation on junk food consumption wouldn't be unfavorable. I also think the damage of continuously eating junk food isn't very comparable to the damage done by being a chronic smoker.


Aloonatron

Prices plus the pub smoking ban. When I gave up (back around £5 for Marlboros, before the pub smoking van) I lapsed because of Christmas pub smoking but managed to kick the habit for good a few months later.


Substantial-East5781

In my country Moldova, cigarette trafficking to Europe is a very big business. Once I personally saw how they are transported by train, there were about 100 packages


carbartar2

Buy 100 for 1.50/ea or 150, then sell for 10/ea or 1000. That's 850 profit.


ShredFIN

I everything goes as currently planned, Finland will join the 10€+ bandwagon in few years. Average price for a pack now is bit over 9€ if i recall correctly.


ItstheGermanagain

and what color is black? the fuck is this unexplained color scheme?


Flakey_Felatio

Wait.... a package of them? Or one? All "bad things" are taxed so heavily in my country that when I hear prices in other countries I think they're messing with me.


Mmaps_interlude

Package


jsuvhs

Turkey should be red, average cost of 1 pack of cigarette is 16-17 liras equal to around 1.8 euro


JN324

Britain: No smoke, only obesity


gaynorg

I really wish people would only use "euro" for the plural of euro. It sounds so much better.


oiseauvert989

I wonder why an expensive country like Switzerland has cheaper cigarettes than France. Maybe something about Philip Morris HQs being based there. Philip Morris really is a terrible terrible company. Advertising cigarettes on bus stops in Africa and other locations where laws against advertising in places children will see it haven't been implemented or enforced yet. EDIT: I know its due to taxes. The implication is that Philip Morris influences the Swiss government not to increase taxes.


OrderUnclear

> I wonder why an expensive country like Switzerland has cheaper cigarettes than France. Because they are taxed differently.


oiseauvert989

The question is why are they taxed differently....Philip Morris is the answer (and Switzerland being way too friendly with them).


OrderUnclear

They are taxed differently because each country has a different approach to it. The seat of some company doesn't affect this much. Polish cigarettes are extremely cheap even though Philip Morris isn't even close. Same as with alcohol. Beer in Norway is prohibitively expensive event though they brew their own.


oiseauvert989

Philip Morris has a huge influence in Switzerland. I lived there. Its ridiculous. They are a decade behind their neighbouring countries and its a direct result. My original comment was rhetorical. I know the reasons.


OrderUnclear

It's bullshit though. Swiss cigarette prices aren't even that low, they are higher than Germanys.


oiseauvert989

In comparison to the wages yes they are quite low. Its not just the prices though. Its also how they are displayed in shops etc. Everything about it just smacks of a country under the thumb. As i said it wasnt really a question.


the_clash_is_back

Taxes. France has high taxes on. Them


oiseauvert989

Yes its almost all tax. I am implying that Switzerland could easily place higher taxes but doesnt because its busy funneling money for Philip Morris.


Elwilo_3

The reason for Switzerland's low tax on cigarettes is because they are a tax haven. Practically speaking they don't have high taxes on anything.


oiseauvert989

Fuel taxes are quite high for example. Ireland is also a tax haven and it has expensive cigarettes. Tax havens dont have to be low tax on everything.


arthurguillaume

how much cigarettes ? 10 ? 1? 2? 5? 12?????


Batmack8989

A pack of 20, I guess.


Adam5698_2nd

Cigarettes should be *heavily* taxed imo, along with alcohol.


free_thinking123

How about fast food than? McDonald’s… pizza etc.


Elwilo_3

I live in Norway(Narvik) and for 23 dollars you can get a Big Mac, soda, and fries, and somehow we're still the fattest nordic country.😐


BittenHare

Yes


[deleted]

[удалено]


PresidentZeus

Bad health costs us a major cost for others. Take corona as an example; obese people had, as expected, a higher risk of for hospital admission than others.


[deleted]

[удалено]


PresidentZeus

are you complaining about McDonalds being expensive?


[deleted]

[удалено]


PresidentZeus

I doubt it would be restricted to fast food though. And not necessarily all fast food either. And I'm not sure of the social impact, but not being healthy isn't limited to obesity.


[deleted]

[удалено]


free_thinking123

See this is where there’s a huge issue with this argument. Where do you stop? People that drive a motorcycle just for fun, they have no real need for it… just fun. It’s a very risky hobby, do you prohibit that too? Or make it very expensive? Because if you crash it can have enormous cost for society. The rescue operation, hospital recovery, goods that are late due to a traffic jam etc. That’s where I see an issue with these types of prohibitions.


Meior

Insurance for motorcyclists is higher. That's already in place.


daryl_hikikomori

Basically *nothing* is as unhealthy as smoking or as socially destructive as alcohol. The slope of taxing them isn't actually that slippery.


genshiryoku

The argument is that taxation of goods and services with *negative* externalities actually *add value* to the economy. This means that it's an economically smart decision to tax everything with negative externalities. Examples: Smoking, Alcohol, Driving, Flying, Fossil Fuel consumption, Fast food, Meat production, Gambling. If you tax these industries you are increasing the national GDP unlike with regular taxation that has a negative effect on national GDP. If you combine this with subsidizing industries with positive externalities (Health care, Gyms, Vegetables, Bicycles etc) then you can maximize the amount of GDP growth that the free market would have skewed against. If you want to maximize the wealth in a society you need to course correct capitalism on fronts that the average person falls short on.


Timeeeeey

Basically correct the market, cause to what logic says it should be


blackstafflo

At least alcohol is not armful if your consummation is not out of control. Even in small quantity, cigarette are always a health concern.


GreatScotRace

Cigarettes ARE highly taxed lol


elgato_elcid

"Stop having fun!!!"


RadRhys2

Sin taxes don’t tell you to stop having fun, they tell you there’s a social cost that you have to pay for rather than everyone else.


[deleted]

[удалено]


RadRhys2

They reached that conclusion by counting the years non-smokers live longer than smokers and they even acknowledge it. With that in mind they even concluded that healthcare costs would raise because smokers are functionally committing suicide before they age. There’s also more than the medical costs that they directly have to face. There’s the obvious lost productivity and second hand smoke, as well as the problems of fire, litter, and a variety of less obvious things. If we’re to use a CDC estimate of $381 billion lost to smoking in the US and divide it by the estimated population of smokers of 34.1 million as well assume 5% of children smoke which would be 3.7m, that means a single smoker in the US creates a cost of over $10,000 per year.


Orcwin

If it's at other peoples' expense, then yes.


Ffishsticks

A pack of 20 cigarettes in the UK is about £10. The tax for is 16.5% of the retail price plus £4.90 The tax for spirits is £28.74 per litre of pure alcohol. E.g. a 1L bottle of gin at 40% ABV would have a tax of £11.50. Beer, wine, cider and perry have differing taxation levels depending on strength


RadRhys2

In Australia they charge over $26AUD ($20USD €16). That’s something every country can aspire to achieve. There’s also the ads and the pictures that go on every carton. https://m.youtube.com/watch?v=QUJETzycRx0


GeelongJr

Maybe the very cheapest pack you can get for $26. A packet of Malboro Reds (25s) costs $46 for example


iskrivenigelenderi

Holy fuck, does anyone still smoke there ?


iSanctuary00

Pretty sure Norway has them for like 20-30 euro aswell.


nod23c

A lot less, around 15 EUR it seems: https://meny.no/varer/kioskvarer/sigaretter


CT24601

Per cigarette?


sno_boarder

For a package. You're thinking of petrol.


RedCutty

Per cigarette of petrol?


daryl_hikikomori

Petrol cigs would probably be just as healthy as tobacco ones.


viktorbir

Petrol is now sold per units?


L1n9y

What's one petrol, a litre, a gallon, a ml, a molecule?


iSanctuary00

Yes


Ryouconfusedyett

I'm Dutch, 17 year old and just get my cigarettes for regular price but some of my mates get russian shit for like two euros a package, they're usually shit though


VlajserPajser

They all are shit anyway


Ryouconfusedyett

the big brands are great if you're used to smoking


MartelFirst

In France, a pack of 20 Lucky Strikes, for example, is 9,90€. It was 10€ a couple months ago, but for some reason they actually got the price down for once in the past 2 decades.


radders85

Was in Ukraine earlier this year, the prices were fucking glorious for cigarettes and alcohol! Beautiful place with lovely people too! Ps. Fuck all you anti smoking zealots! It’s none of your fucking business what I choose to do and I also don’t appreciate being extorted to do so!


Causemas

If you stop smoking your life will improve in the long term with ridiculously measurable effects. As long as you're young enough, I suppose.


fshot01

Me, a german: I go to Ukraine!


Paramite67

XD lot of french go to germany to buy like 1000 cigs packs


fshot01

Interestingly enough: A lot of germans go to luxembourg to buy cigs


OpenStraightElephant

Given how vastly different costs of living and income levels in a lot of European countries are, this is pretty worthless information.


ozanoyunbozan

turkey should be red. even most expensive cigs are 20₺ which is less than 2 euros.


johnbrooder3006

Classic Kaliningrad Oblast


Pinkcop

I'm guessing every other truck from Eastern Europe is cigarettes being smuggled.


hglman

Just label the black. Its not clever it lacks clarity.


Causemas

10 EUROS?! Also, I understand how raising the price can discourage people from smoking, but having a too steep increase seems like a severe punishment to addicts more than anything else.


Blitzfather

Most smokers in northern France buy them in Belgium and Luxembourg anyway.


sala91

I cannot understand the colors of this map at all...


Uwaaah

cigarettes helped me so much since my anxiety reach the top, but i had to stop because of dyspnea, now i am addicted to o2 helper. Haha, one addiction goes and other comes.