Credit to u/sajed2004 for this one
By - BurgerBoi100
What are you talking about? Sappho was totally straight. She wrote about it herself, and how very attracted she was to her husband, Mr. John Penis from Man Island.
I've always thought a good translation is Dick Johnson from Pen Island.
> Pen Island
> Penis Land
>Mr. John Penis
Herr Johann Schniedelwutz
\*Laughs in Greek deity\*
Hahaha! I think most of them were bi. Like Apollo!
And Artemis was allegedly taking a vow of chastity, while surrounded by numerous attractive “close female companions”
Idk about Artemis. I’m not an expert or anything(but really who on this sub is) but I pretty sure she made it *very* clear that she had no relationships at all, especially with her huntresses. But again, I’m no expert and I’d do your own research. Also, we’ll never know how or what the ancient Greeks believed, since they’re all dead, so it’s really up to a matter of opinion
Asexual gang represented. Thanks Artemisa
She likely was asexual and the huntresses didn't harass her about it like men likely would have.
To be honest considering what the Greeks wrote about the other Gods, I’d be inclined to believe if they said she was celibate then they probably believed it.
It’s not like the Greeks were uncomfortable about their gods getting their ends off.
I do remember there was one male hunter, who then was cursed by Aphrodite for daring not wanting to fuck
Artemis is aroace
There is no attraction. There is only BLOODHUNTER
Also an arrow ace
Gender-bending, being gay/bi and exploring sexuality without putting restrictive societal constraints that it's "sinful" or whatever crap has been an important part of Hinduism for a few millennia now too. Which is why the Kama Sutra, a guide to how to live happily and healthily, has a whole section dedicated to sex.
Too bad that most Hindus today are at the opposite end of what Hindu texts say and are socially very conservative
It’s only during the Mughal era and British Invasion did they put in place laws against same sex relationships
Not only ancient Greek, but gender bending/variance was much more prevalent than one would think in almost all pre-modern mythos being a recurring theme in Norse and ancient Egyptian theology. Furthermore, the hallowed "Spirits" in Native American beliefs and those of Aztecs(or other mesoamerican cultures), it's not uncommon to find agenderism and hermaphroditism.
People just didn't give a fudge about such things those days.
Frederick the great.
Was he? Nice
His father had his gay lover executed in front of him as a teenager, dude has a bonkers story
Rip Katte hope they successfully eloped or whatever in some other universs
He literally had a "palace of friendship" filled with homoerotic art
He just liked his bros very much.
Damn, he was just a persecuted homiesexual like me and the boys.
Not most likely, definitely
He was completely disinterested in his wife, wrote homoerotic letters, was VERY close with some guys
Watch emperor tiger stars video
Alexander the great
Pretty sure he was bi or pan.
The B in LGBT stands for bi my friend
Who said i am gae?
ʸᵒᵘ ᵃʳᵉ ᵍᵃᵉ
r u transgenda?
Confusion of da highest orda
Highly suspected mention is Fredrick the Great
Sad he didn't get on there too, one of the greatest people in European history.
wasnt he kind of anti semetic
Almost everyone in Europe was pretty anti Semitic throughout all ages.
To be fair, so was everybody else
[Frederick the Great out the gate, first servant of the state, oblique attack tactics ain't exactly straight](https://youtu.be/NVbH1BVXywY?t=105).
Didn't Oscar diddle small kids?
Oh, ya, I guess he did. Wow, uncool dude!
Hahaha I'll probably get banned for laughing at this
This not Twitter man.. Everyone here has a Twisted dark sensei of Humour
I've been banned from communities for less haha
I don’t know and don’t care if you’re joking or not, but this is a good time to bring this up:
> Another problem related to terminology arises because sexual abuse of male children by adult men2 is often referred to as "homosexual molestation." The adjective "homosexual" (or "heterosexual" when a man abuses a female child) refers to the victim's gender in relation to that of the perpetrator. Unfortunately, people sometimes mistakenly interpret it as referring to the perpetrator's sexual orientation.
> As an expert panel of researchers convened by the National Academy of Sciences noted in a 1993 report: "The distinction between homosexual and heterosexual child molesters relies on the premise that male molesters of male victims are homosexual in orientation. Most molesters of boys do not report sexual interest in adult men, however" (National Research Council, 1993, p. 143, citation omitted).
> To avoid this confusion, it is preferable to refer to men's sexual abuse of boys with the more accurate label of male-male molestation.
Nice i didn't realize it wasn't gay if they're little boys
Guess I’m not gay then /s
John Meynard Keynes (not sure it that’s the right spelling.)
Whoa seriously, the father of American macroeconomics was gay? Oh man that is going to piss off so many people. xD
He was bisexual. He was married had children but is known to had affairs with other men that he and his wife were most likely associated with (his wife was a famous ballerina).
Who the fuck ever said that anyways
_insert "old man yells at clouds" meme_
History books give that impression. It’s changing fast, but not everywhere
They’re just good friends!!!!
Though sometimes they were. Remember, your best friend will make your family question your sexuality.
someone i was arguing with a few days ago said it was just a modern fad ¯\\\_(ツ)\_/¯
I mean you could have just pointed to Ancient Greece and won instantly, but thank you for teaching me about more.
Has it been proven that Anne Bonney and Mary Reed were actually lovers? Or is that just a Black Sails TV show thing?
For my fellow Americans: Baron von Steuben was a Prussian military officer who trained the American troops at Valley Forge and was crucial to turning the tide of the Revolutionary War.
Roman emperors Trajan and Hadrian. Writer Marcel Proust
And Caesar too!
The Anne Bonny and Mary Read relationship was a later invention by a fiction author that cannot be corroborated in any way possible as there isn't a lot about them.
The only known thing about any relationship is that both were pregnant when they were capture (which saved them from being hanged).
Probably also Willem II of the Netherlands
Anne Bonney and Mary Reede have like no reliable info on them, 99% of stuff about them is probably rumors so I wouldn't reliably put them up there since it's so up in the air.
Leonardo Da Vinci
Alexander the Great totally wasn’t a homo, he just was best buddies with his best best friend😊 really really good buddies😊 like, very very very very good friends😊
More bimo than homo given Alexander fucked anything that moved by the end
You’re right, he **wasn’t gay.**
He was at most Bisexual. He had a wife who he loved and a child with said wife.
You know the "B" part of LGBT‽
Gay in this context refers to men who love other men exclusively and not the LGBT community as a whole.
Oh ya, like, who wouldn’t become a severe alcoholic after your very very close friend dies and then you yourself die 6 months later from alcohol poisoning. Happens all the time
I mean, that actually does but that is besides the point
Hell yeah and she was a fucking baller.
Literally every Roman and Greek person to exist
All of Rome
Alexander, Hephaestion, Caeser.
From what I've read of Anne Bonny and Mary Reed some are doubtful they are LGBT. This has to be taken with a MASSIVE pinch of salt as many traditional historians often (be it intentionally or unintentionally) will not discuss or cover up the fact that a figure is LGBT or not, but for Bonney and Reed's case there is a fair amount of evidence backing it up.
First and foremost, when outside of combat situations Bonny and Reed would wear women's clothing according to the pirates themselves. In fact many of our depictions of Bonny and Reed wearing some loose fitting male clothing was actually designed by men who basically thought it would be "hot".
We also know that at least Bonny did have relations with another male pirate on the same ship as her. She was able to avoid execution as she was pregnant (known as pleading the belly) and supposedly berrated her partner for not fighting alongside her when their ship was captured before walking off and disappearing from history.
Finally it is also worth considering the evidence surrounding Bonny and Reed themselves. Since the 18th century speculation on what Bonny and Reed were like has run rampant, not helped by 2-bit contemporary writers who wanted to glamourise the pirate life. To only make matters worse in terms of hard evidence from the period we know very little. We don't even officially know what happened to Bonny after her ship was captured, we know that she wasn't executed with the others... And that's literally it. And an "Ann Bonny" is recorded being buried a decade later in Jamaica, but sadly Ann Bonny was a pretty common name. This has really muddied the waters for modern historians about what life was *actually* like for Reed and Bonny, and therefore historians even today go back and forth not only on what they were like, and more recently if they were LGBT, but how influential they were on the age of piracy
I did this research a while back when studying pirates for my degree so if there is new information that says otherwise PLEASE let me know as I would love to hear it! Both Bonny and Reed are some of my favourite people in history so I'd love to hear anything more about them!
TLDR: Considerable historical evidence points to the fact that Bonny and Reed were not LGBT
Ya know, I’ve come to expect that, if you’re a old Roman emperor, you’ve had your fair share of lovers, both female and male
I read an article that stated Emperor Claudius was considered a pervert because he only engaged in sex with women, that's how normal and even expected it was to have a male lover in Roman times.
Haha, wow, I didn’t know that!
Caesar was a bottom.
Don’t be silly they weren’t gay they just so happens to be really good friends with people of the same sex :/
Literally every Spartan warrior
What about the 300 Thebians?
The Band of Good Friends, you mean?
Dont forget the samurai
You're thinking of the sacred band,not the Spartans.
Spartans were pretty gay if not openly bisexual
You must know all about that
[It was called pederastry](https://www.reddit.com/r/AskHistorians/comments/52ddj0/status_of_homosexuality_in_ancient_sparta/)
It's pretty widespread idea that Spartan men had sex with the young boys they tutored
An idea as you say,not a fact as is the case with Athenians.
I'm pretty sure the Spartans had a lot of gay sex too man
Yeah, with people of, *ahem, lesser age*
If you say so.
They did my boi Turing dirty,
Fuck the British- A random Indian on reddit
Emperor Ai of the Han Dynasty
The thing about Anne Bonney and Mary Read is that there's no clear evidence that either of them were lovers. I'm pretty sure Anne Bonney was notorious for being Calico Jack's lover.
Literally no one has said that.
I think they mean important ones
Half of Athens
Turkic Sultans with their comfort boys have entered the chat
I’m glad someone mentioned this. Vlad the Impailer’s brother Radu was one. He liked living in Constantinople so much, he decided to stay. Vlad didn’t feel the same
Every woman's man and every man's woman
What's even better is that saying cane from a smear campaign against him. Because in Rome it was fine to be gay, just not to be a bottom. So they everyone was just basically saying "har har he a sub"
I know! I think that makes things even funnier
*ahem* Alexander The Great
the entire ancient greece for that matter
Ya, not my list, I would’ve definitely added him
Oh ya. He had a very close friend named Hephestion who he fought with. Hephestion dies, and six months later Alexander dies from alcohol poisoning. Coincidence, *I think not*
He was at most Bi
What do you mean "at most"? Are we bi lesser than gays? Do we not matter because we can be "StRaIgHt PaSsInG" or some shit?
You’re misinterpreting my simple words. At most as in “if he is anything LGBT he’s Bi.”
I didn’t mean for you to interpret what I have said as you guys being lesser than gay people. Because you’re not.
Edit: spelling mistake
I think they meant on a scale of being attracted to women (straight, the assumed position) -> being attracted to men (gay, the position some were arguing him to be) he is at most in the middle and not all the way to the gay end
This thread is filled with the opposite extreme example of assuming anyone who was close to someone of the same sex or followed different cultural norms must have been gay.
Yes there were gay people all throughout history. But it's not healthy to assume every skeleton hugging in Pompeii was gay. The hard truth is for most anyone without a primary source confirming it we will never know.
I definitely agree. Since we can’t go back in time to ask, we’ll never know. But, for a lot of people, you can look at historical records and very confidently say, “this guy was probably gay.” But I think this has been brought up with Anne Bonney and Mary Reed
You missed James Buchanan
To be fair, i dont think anyone would flaunt about being represented by James Buchanan
James Buchanan is kind of cool, not as a president, but did you know he bought slaves and then freed them in Pennsylvania, that’s based if you ask me
Hey, he’s one of PA’s only presidents. Him and Joe Biden. For a state that’s been around since the beginning you’d think there’d be more.
Edit: it’s literally just a fact people, don’t downvote me cause the mention of someone’s name upsets some of you because you’re children.
Literal who says that, homosexuality is as old as humanity itself, Nero for example, castrated a young boy and married him because he looked like his wife
Ya, it’s just a lot of people say that LGBT+ people haven’t done anything remarkable throughout history, which is simply untrue.
You keep saying "a lot" but I've no one for example
I don’t think I’ve ever thought this in my life
YEAH JULIE DAUBIGNY
isnt Alexander the Great Bi?
I mean, we don’t have any definitive proof of his sexuality, but if you read other comments about him, I described his relation with a man named Hephestion.
Bit of a strawman argument, next to no one thinks that there aren't any lgbt people in history.
Tchaikovsky, possibly Newton
who the fuck ever said that, the first history lesson here in Poland is about ancient greece (we go roughly chronically from ancient greece -> modern time) and like 2nd or 3rd sentence the teacher utters is how Greek men liked to have younger male lovers.
Where I grew up in the US the history lessons on Greece suspiciously left that out.
Nobody ever said that?
A lot of people said. I've had a family member say homosexuality is a disease that appeared in the 70s.
Thankfully no one is queer in my family because otherwise I don't know how they could handle that bullshit
Wow you really need to be ignorant in regards to history to say that there’s never been a gay historical character, like there are hundreds and some of them are pretty well known people
I think they mean important ones.
Or… entire male population of Greece?
Those are diapers full of shit.
Is that what they are? I haven’t watched sponge bob in so long, I can remember that episode!
who tf out here sayin there were no gay ppl ever?
I think they meant people say there aren’t any *important* gay people
Never heard of any of these guys, what are they known for? Genuinely curious, please don't be mean
It’s all good. I’d give them all a look. The ones I know are:
Sappho: a Greek poet who wrote a bunch about how she wanted to have secs with other women and stuff, super gay 10/10 great historical figure
Oscar Wilde: Irish poet who was gay, but he had secs with a 15 yo when he was 40, so uncool man 2/10 good poetry, but diddled a kid
Albert Cashier: Union soldier who was an Irish immigrant, born a woman, lives 53 years as a man 10/10 great guy
Alan Turing: broke Nazi enigma code, saved an estimated 20 million lives, British gov found out he was gay, chemically castrated him, then he killed himself 100/10 great guy, helped kill nazis, very tragic
Look the others up, idk who they are really
literally no one ever said there aren't gays in history
Don’t forget Ancient Greece
Ya, I think we can just assume that all of Ancient Greece was gay at some point
I dont know them.
Wow fascinating, very cool
Any of them???
Literally noone has ever said that, not even homophobes.
Yah, it’s just a lot of people say that LGBT+ people haven’t done anything remarkable throughout history, which is simply untrue.
Lgbtq+people: you need to respecte us because we are different
Me: i respect everyone utile they start to annoy me so get out of my house
Shoutout to the entirety of Ancient Greece and Rome
Ancient Greece although that was a little to pedoie
21 century, people still keep speaking about other people sexual orientation.... do anyone really cares?
Nah, it’s just a lot of people say that LGBT+ people haven’t done anything remarkable throughout history, which is simply untrue.
Idk, just ignore them, you can not argue with antivaxers, because this is like religion, these people is the same thing.
Laurence of Arabia wrote poetry on a man
Would the entirety of ancient greeks be considered bisexual, pansexual, or just horny?
It’s not like the norms necessarily corresponded to higher levels of horniness. But I would say they had a bisexual-normative culture… with a fair amount of nuance and differences from the modern views (importance of topping vs bottoming being the most known) that varies place to place.
Alexander the Great ?
\*Points to all of ancient greece\*
Nobody says that.
No Alan dont eat the apple
Albert Casheir, of the New Hampshire Cashiers?
Never heard of any of them
Oof, look them up. Especially Turing.
Yeah but like who says that
Not this specifically, but a lot of people say that LGBT+ people haven’t done anything remarkable throughout history, which is simply untrue.
King William the second